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AntonH
Norway Heritage Veteran
USA
9216 Posts |
 Posted - 17/04/2019 : 00:45:55
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Perhaps the Morten Sørensen on Salterud in the 1801 Census, born about 1795.
Link
And his marriage
Morten Sorensen
in the Norway, Select Marriages, 1660-1926
Name: Morten Sorensen
Gender: Male
Age: 28
Birth Date: 1799
Marriage Date: 23 nov 1827
Marriage Place: Hof, Hedmark, Norway
Father: Soren Staefensen
Spouse: Olia Uldriksdr
FHL Film Number: 124289
Reference ID: 2:Z38PNC
Father of Olia is Uldrik Johanessen
#31 |
Edited by - AntonH on 17/04/2019 00:53:26 |
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bmcnallie
Medium member
USA
86 Posts |
Posted - 17/04/2019 : 01:28:53
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I think the only Karen Mortensdatter that might be ours would be: The daughter of Morten Sørensen (olsen?) and Olea (Olia) Ulriksdatter. Karen Markusdr bap 28 jan 1821 Biertnes? and Nyen Born Dec 28, 1820
Even though it is written as Markusdatter that could be just an error. On all the records I have found all indicate that Karen's age falls more around 1820/21 than 1825-29. Not sure if we will ever know for sure.
Thanks for the help. I am not sure what else we can look at.
Barb
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AntonH
Norway Heritage Veteran
USA
9216 Posts |
Posted - 17/04/2019 : 02:17:19
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My thoughts are that Karen is listed as having parents Morten Sørensen (olsen?) and Olea (Olia) Ulriksdatter. But I have some doubts about that conclusion Notice that Karen is listed as being born out of wedlock as is Ulrikke born in the same year with what appears to be the same parents. And Ole born in 1823 is also listed as being born out of wedlock. And as is also Carelius Mortensen born in October of 1827. The parents were not married until Nov of 1827.
Also Karen was born Dec 28, 1820 and Ullrike was born July 3, 1821. That does not leave nine months between the two births. So I do not think that the parents are Morten Sørensen (olsen?) and Olea (Olia) Ulriksdatter.. Since we need nine months for the mother Olea can not be the mother of both girls. Morten Sørensen could be the father of both girls but why then would the baptism be recorded incorrectly .
I did change my opinion and now am somewhat convinced that there is only one couple. The mystery only involves the first two girls. The rest of the children seem to be spread out enough to be given to one couple.
I think you have probably found the right Karen but it is still unclear to me who her parents are.
Maybe one of the reasons for all of the various last names associated with Karen is that the parents Morten and Olea are not really her parents. |
Edited by - AntonH on 17/04/2019 02:23:53 |
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AntonH
Norway Heritage Veteran
USA
9216 Posts |
Posted - 17/04/2019 : 02:34:34
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So here is the confirmation of Ulrike in 1836. Farm is Floberg.
#5
And here on Arkivet Forum is a long discussion that includes Ulrikke her marriage and her parents and her parents ancestors
Link
In this forum discussion the participants seem to be fairly convinced that the parents of Ulrikke are Morten Sørensen and Olia Ulriksdatter
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Edited by - AntonH on 17/04/2019 03:43:48 |
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AntonH
Norway Heritage Veteran
USA
9216 Posts |
Posted - 17/04/2019 : 04:03:41
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This is likely the baptism record for Olea Ulriksdatter; Father is Ulrik Johannessen Floberg and mother is Maria Andersdatter Nyen. Seems to be born out of wedlock.
Link
Looks like Marie Andersdatter Nyen married Kristian Olsen in 1798.
Link
Olea in the 1801 Census, Mother is ?
1801
Wrong Olea, see below for the correct Olea in the 1801 Census
And Ulrik seems to have fathered a child in 1795 also named Olea and with a girl named Sigrid Pedersdatter
Link
And another Olea in 1799 with a Marthe Olsdatter
Link
Ulrik seems to have been a busy fellow
"E: Ulrik er ""Ungkarl""." Mors leiemålsnr.: 2.Fars leiemålsnr.: 4. |
Edited by - AntonH on 19/04/2019 02:29:48 |
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jkmarler
Norway Heritage Veteran
USA
7765 Posts |
Posted - 17/04/2019 : 16:21:51
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quote:
Originally posted by lyndal40
My thoughts are that Karen is listed as having parents Morten Sørensen (olsen?) and Olea (Olia) Ulriksdatter. But I have some doubts about that conclusion Notice that Karen is listed as being born out of wedlock as is Ulrikke born in the same year with what appears to be the same parents. And Ole born in 1823 is also listed as being born out of wedlock. And as is also Carelius Mortensen born in October of 1827. The parents were not married until Nov of 1827.
Also Karen was born Dec 28, 1820 and Ullrike was born July 3, 1821. That does not leave nine months between the two births. So I do not think that the parents are Morten Sørensen (olsen?) and Olea (Olia) Ulriksdatter.. Since we need nine months for the mother Olea can not be the mother of both girls. Morten Sørensen could be the father of both girls but why then would the baptism be recorded incorrectly .
I did change my opinion and now am somewhat convinced that there is only one couple. The mystery only involves the first two girls. The rest of the children seem to be spread out enough to be given to one couple.
I think you have probably found the right Karen but it is still unclear to me who her parents are.
Maybe one of the reasons for all of the various last names associated with Karen is that the parents Morten and Olea are not really her parents.
Granted it's not the usual thing but...
"She Gave Birth in February, and Then Again Last Week
NEWS NOW Newser — Arden Dier 28 March 2019
Arifa Sultana gave birth to her first child in late February. Her next two came less than a month later—via a previously unknown second womb. It was one shock after another for the 20-year-old Bangladeshi woman, whose water broke 26 days after her vaginal delivery of a premature baby boy at a rural hospital, per AFP.
Sultana, who is "very poor" and "never had an ultrasound before," rushed to another hospital, this one in Jessore district, where an ultrasound confirmed she was still pregnant and with twins, no less, Dr.
Sheila Poddar tells the BBC. Poddar delivered the healthy twins—a boy and girl—via C-section late last week. "Everything went well" and the family was able to leave the hospital after four days.
There are often no symptoms for the one in 3,000 women with double uteruses, a condition dubbed uterus didelphys. It's caused when the two small tubes that join to create the uterus in a female fetus fail to merge completely and therefore develop separately, according to the Mayo Clinic, which notes "many women with a double uterus have normal sex lives, pregnancies, and deliveries." Still, the odds of carrying babies in both wombs is one in 5 million, per the Week.
Though happy with her new bundles—likely conceived at the same time—Sultana worries about "how we will manage such a huge responsibility" on her husband's $70 monthly salary.
"I will try my best to keep them happy," her husband says. "
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bmcnallie
Medium member
USA
86 Posts |
Posted - 18/04/2019 : 03:33:59
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Well.....that is a strange story.
I was wondering if the December 28 birthday of Karen might have been a baptism? Perhaps the baptism was done later than usual.
Barb |
Barb |
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AntonH
Norway Heritage Veteran
USA
9216 Posts |
Posted - 18/04/2019 : 17:00:06
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| A real puzzle. It might be worthwhile to see what can be found in the Bygdebøker for Åsnes. I will send a email off to Michael Swanson <michael.swanson@library.und.edu> , the research librarian at University of North Dakota. He will give it a quick look and if he finds anything you can communicate with him directly. |
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bmcnallie
Medium member
USA
86 Posts |
Posted - 18/04/2019 : 20:04:09
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| I have seen the 1865 Bygdeboker where it mentions Kristian Henrikson and Karen Mortensdatter and Ole Gunderson as Stepson and Karen (Daughter). So maybe he could find something else on the people we think are the parents of Karen (Morten Sorensen and Olea Ulriksdatter). |
Barb |
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AntonH
Norway Heritage Veteran
USA
9216 Posts |
Posted - 18/04/2019 : 22:10:18
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quote:
I have seen the 1865 Bygdeboker
Do you know the title of the book you mention.
Here are the bygdebøker on Åsnes that are at UND
Åsnes — Arne G. Brekke Bygdebok Collection
Åsnes
Fylke
Hedmark
Author Title Year Call Number Type Notes
Åsnesboka, v. 1 1953 DL596.A28 A25 Farms
Åsnesboka, v. 2 1956 DL596.A28 A25 Farms |
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AntonH
Norway Heritage Veteran
USA
9216 Posts |
Posted - 18/04/2019 : 22:15:30
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The assumed parent of Olea is a Ulrik Johannessen of Floberg farm. He seems to have fathered at least four children out of wedlock. Three of them name Olea.
Søren b 1791, mother Olea Eriksdatter Betnes
Link
Olea b 1794 mother Marie Andersdatter Nyen
Link
Olea b 1795 mother Sirj Pedersdatter Floberg
Link
And lastly Olea b 1799 mother Marthe Olsdatter
Probably married in 1796 to Marte Oldatter Birke , fathered sevreral chidren with this women.
Link
And probably died in 1814 as Ulrik Johansen Floberghagen
Link |
Edited by - AntonH on 19/04/2019 02:30:55 |
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AntonH
Norway Heritage Veteran
USA
9216 Posts |
Posted - 18/04/2019 : 22:31:30
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Might be worth following Maria Andersdatter Nyen mother of one of the Olea"s.
Looks like Marie Andersdatter Nyen married Kristian Olsen in 1798.
Link
Christian Olsen
in the Norway, Select Marriages, 1660-1926
Name: Christian Olsen
Gender: Male
Marriage Date: 4 jan 1798
Marriage Place: Hof ,Hedmark,Norway
Spouse: Maria Andersd
FHL Film Number: 124288
So here are Christian Olsen and Maria Arnesdatter with daughter Else born in 1798 and daughter of Maria born in 1794 and here named Olea Halvorsdtter and listed as Hendes uægte daatter. All on the farm Sønsterud.
1801
So for at least your people of interest, I would say the names found in the parish records are suspect.
An example mother of Else is listed in the record as Maria Embrethsdatter.
Link
And for Ole born in 1800 mother is called Maria Andersdatter which is likely correct.
Link
Someone could please translate this ""E: Ole er ""Hms""."" |
Edited by - AntonH on 19/04/2019 00:10:42 |
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bmcnallie
Medium member
USA
86 Posts |
Posted - 18/04/2019 : 23:47:19
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I have seen and have copy of pages 164 and 165 of the Asnesboka Bind I--Gitt Ut Av, Asnes Kommune 1953.
Thanks for all the links. |
Barb |
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AntonH
Norway Heritage Veteran
USA
9216 Posts |
Posted - 18/04/2019 : 23:52:21
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I will pass that info onto Michael at UND and we will see what he comes up with.
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AntonH
Norway Heritage Veteran
USA
9216 Posts |
Posted - 19/04/2019 : 01:48:41
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Well you will find this profile on Geni.com interesting.
Geni.com
The birth date for Karen is listed as Dec 28, 1832? They are referring to the girl who you feel is not the Karen mother of Ole.
They have chosen the Olea born in 1799 (see above) whose parents were Ulrik Johansen and Marthe Olsdatter as wife of Morten Sørensen,
Here is the baptism record for the stepbrother of Karen, Geni profile has Grue as the parish but it is Hof
Christian Mortensen
in the Norway, Select Baptisms, 1634-1927
Name: Christian Mortensen
Gender: Male
Birth Date: 31 aug 1818
Baptism Date: 18 okt 1818 (18 Oct 1818)
Baptism Place: , Hof, Hedmark, Norway
Father: Morten Sorensen
Mother: Kari Torstensd
FHL Film Number: 124288
#65
He is living in Grue in 1865 and census lists Grue as his birthplace.
1865
So my current guess would be that the father of Karen born in 1820 is Morten Sørensen and the mother is Kari Torstensdatter or unknown woman. |
Edited by - AntonH on 19/04/2019 23:08:11 |
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Karen Mortensdatter
