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MarkPeter
Medium member
Australia
98 Posts |
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jkmarler
Norway Heritage Veteran
USA
7765 Posts |
 Posted - 03/05/2019 : 04:33:27
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quote:
Originally posted by MarkPeter
Ok, Ellen Cavanagh/Cavanaugh - It looks like she was in Troy for only 2 months when the census was done. Maybe Johan Carl Palmstrom OR Charles Peterson met Ellen in New York City earlier and moved to Troy with her for work or met her in Troy. Then they got married in Troy and in about November they set sail for Australia.
If Johan Carl Palmstrom's occupation is maritime, perhaps he was part of the shipping industry up and down the Hudson River? |
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MarkPeter
Medium member
Australia
98 Posts |
Posted - 03/05/2019 : 06:22:19
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| Yes maybe. But i think he got to USA about 1854/55, so maybe got ship to Quebec City, like Ellen Cavanagh might have as well, then they met in Oswego City and travelled by train to Troy, got married, then heard of the Victorian Australian Gold rush and got back on train to New York and sailed to Australia on the ship named Gertrude and found nothing but Love. LOL. Who knows???????? How do i get a shipping list for passengers leaving the USA for Australia in 1855/56 on the Gertrude boat? thx all..... |
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jkmarler
Norway Heritage Veteran
USA
7765 Posts |
Posted - 03/05/2019 : 13:49:12
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| Technically, passenger lists are not composed for outset of voyages. They are the list of people as they arrive at port. |
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MarkPeter
Medium member
Australia
98 Posts |
Posted - 29/06/2019 : 04:53:15
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Johan Carl Palmstrom Born 1829, left Kristiansand, Norway in abt 1855 and went to Australia. This is from the Lange/Palmstrom website. About 7 months ago, it listed that he came to Australia via USA. So, I think it is my Johan Carl Palmstrom ( Then Charles Peterson ) that is apart of the Noble Lange/Palmstrom Family. I can’t find anyone with the name Johan Carl Palmstrom in any Australian records, such as marriage, death, children’s baptisms, etc. from 1855 until today. What do you all think?
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AntonH
Norway Heritage Veteran
USA
9216 Posts |
Posted - 29/06/2019 : 16:49:15
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quote:
Johan Carl Palmstrom Born 1829, left Kristiansand, Norway in abt 1855 and went to Australia. This is from the Lange/Palmstrom website. About 7 months ago, it listed that he came to Australia via USA
What evidence does the Lange/Palmstrom website give for this conclusion? Have you ever communicated with them? |
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MarkPeter
Medium member
Australia
98 Posts |
Posted - 30/06/2019 : 08:59:54
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| Hi again Lyndal40. The Palmstrom website www.palmstrom.net stated that a Johan Carl Palmstrom left Kristiansand, Norway in about 1855 and came to Australia via USA. My Charles Peterson has on his children’s birth certificates he was from Arendal, Norway and was born in 1829. Their is no Charles Peterson from Arendal, Norway, born in 1829 and their is no Johan Carl Palmstrom to be found anywhere in Australian records, like marriage, death, childs baptisms, etc. Is that evidence to at least be on the right track? Thx Mark |
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MarkPeter
Medium member
Australia
98 Posts |
Posted - 30/06/2019 : 09:18:48
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| Hi, Lyndal40. I also have a bit of text with info, if you would like me to email it to you, thx again Mark |
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MarkPeter
Medium member
Australia
98 Posts |
Posted - 30/06/2019 : 09:27:25
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| Re Georg Nicolai Palmstrom Born 1841, brother of Johan Carl Palmstrom. Georg Nicolai went to New York and died on the 25th Feb 1918 in New York, USA. Some of his children also ended up in Albany, New York, USA, the same as Johan Carl Palmstrom and also his new wife Ellen Cavanagh looks like she worked as a servant in Albany. |
Edited by - MarkPeter on 30/06/2019 09:32:41 |
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MarkPeter
Medium member
Australia
98 Posts |
Posted - 30/06/2019 : 11:01:51
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Yes, I have communicated with them They said, they are not sure, because they don’t know what the child’s name was from the affair that Johan Palmstrom, (Johan Mattson Lange’s Son)had with a girl named Anna. He’s an unknown Palmstrom by blood.
#1 Johan Mattson Lange (1621 – 1686), vår stamfar, er begravet i Jakobs kirke i Stockholm der hans begravelsesvåpen er satt opp. Johan Lange ble adlet under navnet Palmström, se adelsbrevet (Sköldebrevet) av 5. desember 1674. Johan var gift med (1) Anna Wigen og med (2) Christina Nilsdottir Emporagria
#302 Johan Palmström (1648 - 1705), eldste sønn av #1 Johan M. Lange og Anna Wigen. Hans datter utenfor ekteskap #548 Anna Jonsdotter er sannsynligvis forbindelsen til den adelige familien Palmström, nobil 867 |
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MarkPeter
Medium member
Australia
98 Posts |
Posted - 30/06/2019 : 11:12:43
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This Lorentz was Living near enough next door to the address where Elise Marie Palmstrom, Johan Carl Palmstrom’s Mum, was in 1865.
Name: Lorents Palmstrøm
Gender: Male
Age: 30
Birth Date: 1828
Marriage Date: 12 mar 1858
Marriage Place: Sandar, Vestfold, Norway
Father: Andreas Palmstrøm
Spouse: Severine Marie Hansdatter
FHL Film Number: 278245
Reference ID: Bk 7 p313 |
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AntonH
Norway Heritage Veteran
USA
9216 Posts |
Posted - 30/06/2019 : 17:55:55
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So perhaps this is then the outline of the Tree from what the Palmstrøm family thinks is the route from their family to the Johan Carl Palmstrøm who ended up in Australia by way of America.
Palmstrøm Family proposal
Johan Mattson Lange b 1621
married Anna Wisen
They had a son Johan Palmstrøm b 1648
Their son Johan Palmstrøm had a daughter with an unnamed women
She was named Anna Jonsdotter and married a Petter Eriksson
They had a son who called himself Jonas Palmstrøm b abt 1704
Jonas Palmstrøm married Gunilla Christina Morman
They had child of unknown name ( en sonn #255, Palmstrøm designation) who could have been the Johan Palmstrøm found in the 1801 Census in Kristiansand and who was born about 1762. An issue could be that Jonas Palmstrøm died about 1760 but the dates that far back could be approximate at best.
The path from the Johan Palmstrøm found in the 1801 Census in Kristiansand born about 1672 back to unknown (en sonn #255, Palmstrøm designation) is a leap of faith at present. But seems to be the best you have.
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Edited by - AntonH on 30/06/2019 18:02:18 |
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AntonH
Norway Heritage Veteran
USA
9216 Posts |
Posted - 30/06/2019 : 19:21:50
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One comment I have after looking at the Palmstrøm website again is that the website seems to indicate that Gunnnilla Christina remarried after the death of Jonas Palmstrøm in 1760. So perhaps the Johan Palmstrom found in Krisitainsand in 1801 Census could be her son by a non Palmstrom male.
Here is the line from the website. translated from Swedish
"Jonas's widow remarried with an Arwidsson,(Arvidsson ) who devastated the whole wealth"
Here is a link to the page in the website
Link
A different part of the website gives this information for her second marriage
Hon var då omgift i Kville den 17 augusti 1762, med korpralen Peter Ekerot |
Edited by - AntonH on 01/07/2019 23:06:46 |
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MarkPeter
Medium member
Australia
98 Posts |
Posted - 01/07/2019 : 04:56:12
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| Ok, thx for this. I will look into it more, again, thx again Lyndal40 for all your continuing support. |
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MarkPeter
Medium member
Australia
98 Posts |
Posted - 01/07/2019 : 07:26:32
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Ok, so maybe Anna Jonsdotter is the Johan Carl Palmstrom Family missing link?
One can now imagine:
1. The nobleman Lars Palmström (1681-1735) is the father in some way
2. One can imagine a connection to Norrköping, where there is a Palm stream family, including Carl Palmström, born 1707.
3. Christianstad has various Palmström in the mid-18th century (there is also Morman).
4. Mendettroligasteäradelsmannen, Johan Palmström's (1648-1705) first child, except the marriage in Nedre Ullerud, born about 1682 to 1686, according to Kils heritage, in October 1687.
The birth notes in Nedre Ullerud are not easy to read, for example, there are two different registers for births.
Most often, the father is listed, but on October 12, 1685, two girls were born in Nedre Ullerud. Both by name Anna; both without a father's declaration.
It is very likely that one is = Anna Jonsdotter = Jonas Palmström's mother.
In Nedre Ullerud Johan Palmström is often signed as Jean, or Jacob.
5. In the town of Christianstad, in the middle of the 18th century, there are close together both Palmström and Morman / Murman families.
There is, for example, a watchman / tobacco planter Jonas Palmström, married to Helena Hörberg, who gets her daughter Johanna, born on February 11, 1748, and son Jonas, born October 17, 1752.
The family moves to Malmö.
Son Jonas Palmström moves to Domkyrko congregation in Gothenburg, October 7, 1779.
He is called thin-binder bed. It is well the same man who died in Uddevalla, June 25, 1800, by lungot.
He is then called a thin-tie master and is a widower.
Married to widow Anna Blom / Vinberg on November 14, 1783.
In Christianstad there is also the artillery hanger Anders Morman, whose daughter Catharina Maria was baptized on August 9, 1750.
6. In Stockholm there is at this time both Palmström and Morman families.
7. In Finland, the Finnish archipelago has several with the name Palmström.
Professor Arnfinn Palmström already knew these people in the 1910s.
8. Lieutenant Johan Palmström, # 867, (1648-1705), was probably married once before marriage in 1681 with Anna Maria (= Annicka) Blanckenfjell 1681.
Not far from Christianstad is the noble family Morman, # 1868, of Danish origin Mormand.
Naturalized in 1732 with Johan Anton Morman at Gedsholm, in Ekeby parish.
I have not found any direct connection to our Morman.
Johan Anton Morman had several relatives Mormand / Morman, who did not receive Swedish company, living in the neighborhood.
However, it is clear that there is a priest in the noble family of Morman at this time. |
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Mystery of Johan Carl Palmstrom
