All Forums | Main Page | Profile | Register | Active Topics | Members | Search | FAQ
Username:
Password:
Save Password
Forgot your Password?

 All Forums
 NORWEGIAN GENEALOGY
 General genealogy
 Dyre (1859) and Thomas (1864) from Luster to US?
 New Topic  Reply to Topic
 Printer Friendly
Author Previous Topic Topic Next Topic  

loyane
Junior member

Germany
73 Posts

Posted - 17/04/2021 :  18:39:04  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Dear Listers!

Another big challenge for you today, which has rested on my desk for more than 40 years:

Johannes Torkildson Ronnei/Kalhagen (1832-1914) and Ingeborg Andersdotter Hunshammer (1830-1901) farmed for a few years the Kalhagen farm in Luster County, but later became «husmannsfolk» at Hesjebakken under the neighboring Ronnei farm. They lived and died in Norway. However, they had two sons who have disappeared in America:

* Dyre Johannesson Ronnei/Kalhagen, born in Luster Co., Norway June 6, 1859, emigrated in 1883

* Thomas Johannesson Ronnei/Kalhagen, born in Luster Co., Norway Dec. 28, 1864, emigrated in 1884

As the story goes among relatives in Norway, one of the brothers shall have lost one arm in an accident as a young man, and then one of them is supposed to have resided at Williston, ND in the 1920's, but neither of these facts have been possible to verify!

Any chance one or both of them can be located in America?

I would be very happy for any suggestions and thank you all very much in advance!

Very sincerely yours,

Lars E. Oyane

jkmarler
Norway Heritage Veteran

USA
7765 Posts

Posted - 18/04/2021 :  05:54:23  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Dyre's destination in US was something beginning with Stone _____ (or possibly Stoughton ) in Wisconsin. He came on the Hibernian and landed at Halifax 8 May 1883. He's # 152 on page 14 of the list.
Go to Top of Page

loyane
Junior member

Germany
73 Posts

Posted - 18/04/2021 :  12:02:00  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Dear Jackie and other Listers!

Thank you very much, Jackie, for your latest message! However, I am having problems finding the passenger list in question! What do I do wrong? Is there a handwritten scan of it?

Maybe Thomas can also be located in a passenger list giving his destination: https://www.digitalarkivet.no/view/8/pe00000000671899

Thanks again!

Very sincerely yours,

Lars E. Oyane
Go to Top of Page

AntonH
Norway Heritage Veteran

USA
9141 Posts

Posted - 18/04/2021 :  16:14:08  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:

Thank you very much, Jackie, for your latest message! However, I am having problems finding the passenger list in question! What do I do wrong? Is there a handwritten scan of it?



Dyre 152

https://ibb.co/7pVFkGX

Edited by - AntonH on 18/04/2021 16:18:43
Go to Top of Page

AntonH
Norway Heritage Veteran

USA
9141 Posts

Posted - 18/04/2021 :  16:25:11  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Here is the best guess as to how the person was transcribed by Ancestry

Lizze J Romier
in the Canada, Arriving Passengers Lists, 1865-1935
Name: Lizze J Romier
Gender: Male
Arrival Age: 20
Birth Year: abt 1863
Departure Port: Liverpool, England
Arrival Date: 8 May 1883
Arrival Port: Halifax, Nova Scotia, Canada and Baltimore, Maryland, USA
Vessel: Hibernian

Hibernian
Go to Top of Page

loyane
Junior member

Germany
73 Posts

Posted - 18/04/2021 :  16:33:49  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Dear Anton and other Listers!

Thank you very much for sending me a scan of the passenger record!

There is no doubt at all! Dyre J. Ronnei had the destination of Stoughton, WI, which was a «general starting point» for very many emigrants from Luster Co., Norway at that time!

And I got a good laugh at the transcription presented by ancestry... You have to be locally familiar with the names in order to interpret them more-or-less correctly! I would actually be very interested in helping out with such transcriptions if I had a chance to...

Thanks again for your great assistance!

But how about Thomas and his 1884 emigration?

Very sincerely yours,

Lars E. Oyane

Edited by - loyane on 22/04/2021 12:55:50
Go to Top of Page

jkmarler
Norway Heritage Veteran

USA
7765 Posts

Posted - 18/04/2021 :  17:26:46  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by loyane

Dear Jackie and other Listers!

Thank you very much, Jackie, for your latest message! However, I am having problems finding the passenger list in question! What do I do wrong? Is there a handwritten scan of it?

Maybe Thomas can also be located in a passenger list giving his destination: https://www.digitalarkivet.no/view/8/pe00000000671899

Thanks again!

Very sincerely yours,




I have looked since there were only about 25 others leaving the same day as Thomas but no luck so far in checking their names as well as his. It would be valuable since it seems likely he would have "gone to" a near relative, meaning Dyre.
Go to Top of Page

AntonH
Norway Heritage Veteran

USA
9141 Posts

Posted - 21/04/2021 :  02:22:43  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
But how about Thomas and his 1884 emigration?



Thomas Johansson
in the Canada, Arriving Passengers Lists, 1865-1935
Name: Thomas Johansson
Gender: Male
Arrival Age: 19
Birth Year: abt 1865
Departure Port: Liverpool, England
Arrival Date: 14 Apr 1884
Arrival Port: Halifax, Nova Scotia, Canada
Vessel: Oregon

Passenger following Thomas is Britha Gjertsdatr Foshougen age 35 and her two children. Listed as wife but obviously not the wife of Thomas.

https://ibb.co/MPxxpzm

Oregon


Edited by - AntonH on 21/04/2021 02:24:47
Go to Top of Page

AntonH
Norway Heritage Veteran

USA
9141 Posts

Posted - 21/04/2021 :  02:26:11  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Britha Gjertsdatr Foshougen

https://www.digitalarkivet.no/view/8/pe00000000671900

Brita Gesdatter
in the Canada, Arriving Passengers Lists, 1865-1935
Name: Brita Gesdatter
Gender: Female
Arrival Age: 35
Birth Year: abt 1849
Departure Port: Liverpool, England
Arrival Date: 14 Apr 1884
Arrival Port: Halifax, Nova Scotia, Canada
Vessel: Oregon

Edited by - AntonH on 21/04/2021 02:28:09
Go to Top of Page

AntonH
Norway Heritage Veteran

USA
9141 Posts

Posted - 21/04/2021 :  02:49:24  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Not a lot of good candidates for Thomas. But there is this one in Minnesota. Arrival year is 1885, 1884 (1888), 1889, 1884.

1900 Census

https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:M93M-V4T

https://www.ancestry.com/discoveryui-content/view/26720978:7602
Go to Top of Page

jkmarler
Norway Heritage Veteran

USA
7765 Posts

Posted - 21/04/2021 :  09:45:58  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Mille Lacs Thomas Johnson in FAG:
https://www.findagrave.com/memorial/51727659/thomas-johnson

2 Tom or Thomas Johnson deaths in the state index of deaths in 1937:
Johnson Tom March 19, 1937 Hennepin County 1937-MN-019612

Johnson Tom Aka Thomas October 9, 1937 Hennepin County 1937-MN-022408

https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:ZHVD-H46Z
Mother named as Helen Knutson....


Edited by - jkmarler on 21/04/2021 09:53:06
Go to Top of Page

jkmarler
Norway Heritage Veteran

USA
7765 Posts

Posted - 21/04/2021 :  09:54:21  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by lyndal40

quote:
But how about Thomas and his 1884 emigration?



Thomas Johansson
in the Canada, Arriving Passengers Lists, 1865-1935
Name: Thomas Johansson
Gender: Male
Arrival Age: 19
Birth Year: abt 1865
Departure Port: Liverpool, England
Arrival Date: 14 Apr 1884
Arrival Port: Halifax, Nova Scotia, Canada
Vessel: Oregon

Passenger following Thomas is Britha Gjertsdatr Foshougen age 35 and her two children. Listed as wife but obviously not the wife of Thomas.

https://ibb.co/MPxxpzm

Oregon





The record also says Thomas is contracted to go to Portland (which I assume means Portland, Maine):
https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:2Q92-ZN2
Go to Top of Page

loyane
Junior member

Germany
73 Posts

Posted - 21/04/2021 :  12:46:29  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Dear Jackie, Anton and other Listers!

Thank you very much for several interesting messages in regard to Thomas Johnson!

That «candidate» from Mille Lacs Co., MN looks very exciting. His birthmonth is not quite a «match», but we all know that birth information may often be off...

I have been looking for the family in the 1895 state census for MN, but they are NOT in Mille Lacs Co., MN at that time, and I notice that at least one of the children was born in WI (Ida Sep. 1896), and ancestry suggests this be Ida Emelia born in Jackson Co., WI Sep. 3, 1896 to Tollef and Ellen Johnson: https://www.ancestry.com/imageviewer/collections/60722/images/41742_314966-00385?treeid=&personid=&hintid=&usePUB=true&usePUBJs=true&_ga=2.259746058.1621079734.1618435785-390650824.1612707015&pId=783720

And in Martin Co., MN I find this marriage:
MARTIN Book C, Page 394 05/31/1894 JOHNSON, TOLLEF KNUDSEN, ELEN

So I fear this is probably not the Thomas that we are looking for...

HOWEVER, according to the passenger record from 1884 showing Thomas Johannessen as an emigrant, you, Jackie, say he intended to go to Portland! I cannot see that note anywhere in the passenger record, and I wonder: Could it be Portland, ND (where MANY Sognings lived at that time) or even Portland, OR?

The 1885 territorial census for ND shows several Thomas Johnsons who may «match»; in particular my eye catches the one in Steele Co., ND just west of Portland a little ways...: https://www.ancestry.com/search/collections/1078/?name=thomas_Johnson&birth=1864_norway_5173&birth_x=2-0-0_1-0&count=50&name_x=ps_ps&residence=1885&residence_x=0-0-0

I would also like to make another note: I have seen several Dyres from Luster Co., Norway who become David in America. Could «our» Dyre have become David Johnson?

How about this guy in Milwaukee, WI: https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:XRW5-ZQ7

Name David Johnson
Sex Male
Age 52
Death or Burial Date Nov 1909
Death or Burial Place Milwaukee, Wisconsin, United States
Death or Burial Place (Original) Milw. Med. College
Death Date 26 Nov 1909
Death Place Wauwatosa, Milwaukee, Wisconsin
Birth Date 5 Jun 1857
Birthplace Norway
Marital Status Single
Occupation Night Watch
Race White

NB: Birth date is just one day off!

Here is the same guy in 1900, single and emigrated 1882: https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:S3HY-6619-NNQ?i=11&cc=1325221&personaUrl=%2Fark%3A%2F61903%2F1%3A1%3AMMVV-BMH

There was another David Johnson in Milwaukee, WI at the same time, married to a Sarah, but he (born Dec. 1859) apparenty moved to Aurora, IL

Maybe an obituary or a death notice can be found for David Johnson who died in 1909?

Thanks again for your great efforts trying to locate these brothers!

Very sincerely yours,

Lars E. Oyane

Edited by - loyane on 22/04/2021 12:56:22
Go to Top of Page

jkmarler
Norway Heritage Veteran

USA
7765 Posts

Posted - 21/04/2021 :  15:27:50  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by loyane

Dear Jackie, lundal40 and other Listers!

Thank you very much for several interesting messages in regard to Thomas Johnson!

That «candidate» from Mille Lacs Co., MN looks very exciting. His birthmonth is not quite a «match», but we all know that birth information may often be off...

I have been looking for the family in the 1895 state census for MN, but they are NOT in Mille Lacs Co., MN at that time, and I notice that at least one of the children was born in WI (Ida Sep. 1896), and ancestry suggests this be Ida Emelia born in Jackson Co., WI Sep. 3, 1896 to Tollef and Ellen Johnson: https://www.ancestry.com/imageviewer/collections/60722/images/41742_314966-00385?treeid=&personid=&hintid=&usePUB=true&usePUBJs=true&_ga=2.259746058.1621079734.1618435785-390650824.1612707015&pId=783720

And in Martin Co., MN I find this marriage:
MARTIN Book C, Page 394 05/31/1894 JOHNSON, TOLLEF KNUDSEN, ELEN

So I fear this is probably not the Thomas that we are looking for...

HOWEVER, according to the passenger record from 1884 showing Thomas Johannessen as an emigrant, you, Jackie, say he intended to go to Portland! I cannot see that note anywhere in the passenger record, and I wonder: Could it be Portland, ND (where MANY Sognings lived at that time) or even Portland, OR?

The 1885 territorial census for ND shows several Thomas Johnsons who may «match»; in particular my eye catches the one in Steele Co., ND just west of Portland a little ways...: https://www.ancestry.com/search/collections/1078/?name=thomas_Johnson&birth=1864_norway_5173&birth_x=2-0-0_1-0&count=50&name_x=ps_ps&residence=1885&residence_x=0-0-0

I would also like to make another note: I have seen several Dyres from Luster Co., Norway who become David in America. Could «our» Dyre have become David Johnson?

How about this guy in Milwaukee, WI: https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:XRW5-ZQ7

Name David Johnson
Sex Male
Age 52
Death or Burial Date Nov 1909
Death or Burial Place Milwaukee, Wisconsin, United States
Death or Burial Place (Original) Milw. Med. College
Death Date 26 Nov 1909
Death Place Wauwatosa, Milwaukee, Wisconsin
Birth Date 5 Jun 1857
Birthplace Norway
Marital Status Single
Occupation Night Watch
Race White

NB: Birth date is just one day off!

Here is the same guy in 1900, single and emigrated 1882: https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:S3HY-6619-NNQ?i=11&cc=1325221&personaUrl=%2Fark%3A%2F61903%2F1%3A1%3AMMVV-BMH

There was another David Johnson in Milwaukee, WI at the same time, married to a Sarah, but he (born Dec. 1859) apparenty moved to Aurora, IL

Maybe an obituary or a death notice can be found for David Johnson who died in 1909?

Thanks again for your great efforts trying to locate these brothers!

Very sincerely yours,




The far right column is called "Port at which passengers have contracted to land." Everyone on that page has that designation sort of dittoed.

Glad you had some experience with what an anglicized version of Dyre could be, I was drawing a complete blank.

This might be your David in FAG:
https://www.findagrave.com/memorial/110494268/david-johnson

If he is the same man as you found, probably means he was "on the county" and his body was donated to medical science.

Found no mention of David Johnson in 1909 as in death notice nor obituary in the Milwaukee paper I have access to.

Edited by - jkmarler on 21/04/2021 17:19:05
Go to Top of Page

AntonH
Norway Heritage Veteran

USA
9141 Posts

Posted - 22/04/2021 :  03:50:29  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
A little more information on this version of FAG

David Johnson
in the Global, Find a Grave Index for Burials at Sea and other Select Burial Locations, 1300s-Current
Name: David Johnson
Birth Date: 5 Jun 1857
Birth Place: Norway
Death Date: 26 Nov 1909
Death Place: Milwaukee, Milwaukee County, Wisconsin, United States of America
Has Bio?: N

https://www.findagrave.com/memorial/206158172/david-johnson

https://ibb.co/vx4MFwG
Go to Top of Page
  Previous Topic Topic Next Topic  
 New Topic  Reply to Topic
 Printer Friendly
Jump To:
Norway Heritage Community © NorwayHeritage.com Go To Top Of Page
Snitz Forums 2000
Articles for Newbies:

Hunting Passenger Lists:

An article describing how, and where, to look for passenger information about Norwegian emigrants
    1:   Emigration Records - Sources - Timeline
    2:   Canadian Records (1865-1935)
    3:   Canadian Immigration Records Database
    4:   US arrivals - Customs Passenger Lists
    5:   Port of New York Passenger Records
    6:   Norwegian Emigration Records
    7:   British outbound passenger lists
 

The Transatlantic Crossing:

An article about how the majority of emigrants would travel. It also gives some insight to the amazing development in how ships were constructed and the transportation arranged
    1:   Early Norwegian Emigrants
    2:   Steerage - Between Decks
    3:   By sail - daily life
    4:   Children of the ocean
    5:   Sailing ship provisions
    6:   Health and sickness
    7:   From sail to steam
    8:   By steamship across the ocean
    9:   The giant express steamers
 
Search Articles :
Search the Norway Heritage articles

Featured article