Nils Pedersen family, Sesseng farm in Selbu
DebraI am getting desperate trying to find my Grandmother's family. I know she went by Ingeborg (Inga) Nelson here in America before marrying my grandfather John A. Anderson. Ingeborg was born on Sept 18, 1878 (maybe in Trodjeon) in Norway. She came to America (according to the US census) in 1897 and settled in Buffalo, North Dakota where she lived most of her life here. I have talked with family members and they don't seem to know anything about her other than what I have stated (I have a hard time believing they don't but that is what they say). I don't know how many sisters and brothers she had although I know there were a couple (I only have heard of sisters) and I am trying to find out more about them but so far finding very little other than who they were here and that they also went by Nelson before marrying? What do I do next? I have sent for Grandmother's marriage license, death certificate and looked at all the census we have here and I cannot find anything more about her. Because of the great people on this site translating my Grandfather's letter edged in black, I have traced Grandfather back a couple of generations in Sweden now and that has been exciting but I can't get anywhere with Grandmother and I don't know what to do next. I still have several letters out to family members that lived around Buffalo when Grandmother was still alive but they were very young--still hoping they remember some stories or something though. Thanks for any help you can come up with. I am about out of things to try. We are still looking through Mom's stuff hoping to find something but so far nothing about her mother and family. Debra
jwiborgHi Debra, According to the Ellis Island manifest, Inga Nielsen (19y) from Norway, arrived on the ship "Hekla" on March 22nd, 1897. The ship has travelled from Christiansand (Nor) to Cristiania (Nor) to Copenhagen, Denmark, before crossing the Atlantic. Unfortunately does it seem like the original manifest is missing, so I could't find out to whom she was going...[B)] Here she is, leaving Kristiania on March 04th, 1897: [url="http://129.177.171.80/cgi-win/webcens.exe?slag=visbase&filnamn=EMIOSLO&variabel=0&postnr=122780&fulle=true&spraak=e"]click here[/url] Destination is New York. It looks like she is travelling alone, or maybe together with Martin Alfred Kristoffersen ...? [:)] Place of residence says Kr.a, which is Kristiania (Oslo). Jan
DebraThank you so much Jan. That is the most information as far as her coming over that I have gotten so far. Maybe I can research this a little more now on the Internet. Where do you find all your information? I have looked at the Ellis Island information and couldn't find anything, have looked on Norwegian sites other than this one but I have so little information. I want to find out about her family. In researching Grandfather's family, it has been so fascinating and I am sad I can't find more about her. It is sad when I can't even find out how many sisters and brothers she had and she only died in 1965!! No one in the family seems to know! Did they not talk about their family when they came over or at leaast the ones that didn't come along? My mother mentioned the two sisters Sarah and Mary and I have found the family (grandchildren) of Anna (Nelson) Halstad but they know very little about her either--nothing about her family. Any other ideas anyone has for me would be greatly appreciated. This has become a mystery for me now. Debra dmoseng@charter.net
DebraJan, in looking at the list of names, under occupation, what is 'pige' and is that a very small town where she was from? She told people here that she was born in Trodjeon, that maybe is close by? Is there any way of getting any church records to find out about her sisters and brothers and parents? This does sound like her on that list being the right age and name (close last name anyway). I just thought she came over with at least one sister but when researching the sister that married Ole Halstad it seems Anna (Halstad) must have came over before Grandmother did. Is it hard to look up a Anna (or Anne) Nilson and I believe she came over maybe in 1892 according to our census--also said she was born in Aug of 1869?). She must have been one of the older ones and Grandmother one of the younger children? Debra
BorgeI really do think you should be looking for Trondhjem not Trondjeon. This could be you grandmother leaving Trondhjem in 1897: [url="http://129.177.171.80/cgi-win/webcens.exe?slag=visbase&filnamn=EMITROND&variabel=0&postnr=86235&fulle=true&spraak=e"]Ingeborg Fienstad [/url]. In the other tread about this topic: [url="http://www.norwayheritage.com/snitz/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=1056"] "Looking for grandmother's records" [/url], it seams as the sources are pointing in a direction which makes me believe that your next step maybe should be to check microfilms of baptized in the town of Trondhjem. You need to establish some of that basic information now before getting much further without having to base the research on guesses.
jwiborgHi again, pige means girl... [:)] I managed to locate her manifest..., but there was no new info there. It wrote: Inga Nielsen, 19, female, servant, destination New York, 1 piece of luggage... [:)] It looks like she was travelling alone, at least the person in line above and below was headed to a diff. destination. [url="http://www.ellisislandrecords.org/search/shipManifest.asp?MID=20926753680063986848&FNM=I&LNM=N%25&PLNM=N%25&CGD=F&SYR=1897&EYR=1897&SAGE=19&EAGE=19&RF=3&ALTS=97%7Cne&ALTS=97%7Cnn&pID=104942070807&lookup=104942070807&show=K%3A%5CM237%2D0671%5CM237%2D06711035%2ETIF&origFN=K%3A%5CM237%2D0671%5CM237%2D06710654%2ETIF"]View manifest[/url] Click magnifying glass to enlarge manifest. Here is Ingeborg Fenstads manifest: [url="http://www.ellisislandrecords.org/search/shipManifest.asp?MID=20926753680063986848&FNM=I&LNM=F%25&PLNM=F%25&CGD=F&SYR=1897&EYR=1897&SAGE=18&EAGE=20&RF=8&PID=602489100079"]click here[/url] It looks like she is going to a sister, but the name is hard to read..., take a look at the manifest. Jan
DebraI looked up all the above information in both your posts. The locations in the first Ingeborg sounds like it could be her but the name sounds more correct in the last one as e thought her name wasn't quite the way it was here in America as my sister remembers Mom mentioning something about that but wasn't sure what it was. How would I check the baptism records or parish records without knowing exactly the name? All I know is her birthday. I would love to find out her other family members also and if I knew how to check on hers I shoudl be able to maybe look at theirs? At least the two I know the names of (once I figure out what their name in Norway was). I am just excited I have gotten this far now. I love going and checking on what you put in the messages, it is exciting to see what could be family names coming to life. Thanks, Debra
BriningHi Debra, Have you ordered Anna Halstad's marriage and death certificate? That could be another source of information. Have you found any middle names for either Anna or Inga(Ingeborg)? The best on line sources for searching Norwegian ancestors are [url="http://digitalarkivet.uib.no/cgi-win/WebFront.exe?slag=vis&tekst=meldingar&spraak=e"]The Digitalarkivet[/url] and [url="http://www.familysearch.org/Eng/Search/frameset_search.asp"]The LDS FamilySearch[/url] The LDS also has the films of church records in Norway that can be rented at one of their centers, click on the library tab at the site and you can get a list of the centers. You should read John Føllesdal's articles on searching for Norwegian ancestors. Click on external links below and then General Genealogy, Articles & How To to get to his link. Naming practices in the 1800's were very different from now and you need to understand them before searching in Norway. Hope you get more information that will help in your search Carla
DebraCarla, Thanks again. I think I will send for her (Anna's) marriage and death certificates. I got it confirmed from other information received that she did die on that date so it is hers. I just got so disappointed when I received Grandmother's death thing from the state and her marriage license as it had no new information on it, even got her obituary from the paper and nothing about siblings or parents on it, just her immediate family as far as living children and those who proceeded her in death as well as her husband who had died before her, that was it. Hopefully Anna's will have a little more information. I have learned some sad things about Anna. It is funny how you almost feel 'attached' to these people even though you never knew them. Because of the translation on this site for my grandfather's letter edged in black, I have gotten quite far in Sweden, several genertions back and quite a bit about them and it has been interesting. I only wish I could get more clues here about Grandmother's side. I am still hoping something pops up when I get more information about Anna's family as I have talked personally to her grandchildren and someone on another list (from Norman county) has sent me all the information about the family from the Halstad MN book--it tells all about when Ole and his first wife Anna and their daughter settled in what is now Halstad in 1871. Very interesting reading. Our Anna is just sort of thrown in, no dates when the first Annas died or when he married our Anna--she just appears--and has kids. I have a friend who is a Mormom and I am hoping she will help me with this. I don't see her very often but knows she works at the family center once or so a month and I need to talk with her. I have lots of things I can do but have been going in way too many directions so far with it. I wanted to just follow Grandmother's family at first, then got that lead with Grandfather and it has gone well, then got on the Halstad's to try to find more about Grandmother, fun, but very time consuming. I can't believe how the people are willing to help on these sites too, very nice, thank you. Debra
DebraI just sent for the marriage license and death certificate of Anna, hope there is some kind of information on them as far as HER sisters or siblings and parents. I have also been checking on that one site you told me about (I had been on there before and have found some names but not the ones that are very important now on Grandmother's side). I still am not finding her side at all as far as the Sarah and Mary but those are such common names and I do not know when they came over from Norway for sure or when their birthdays are. I do not know if they went by Nilsen or Nelson either, think they went by Nelson once they got here though as that is what Anna had on her marriage license. I am still searching through hundreds of names on the manifests also. Debra
DebraIt's me again. I am still searching but hadn't gotten any new information until today. I am excited as this is the first I have gotten any names from over in Norway. I received Anna Halstad's death certificate today and it actually has her parent's names on it. I don't know if anyone can help me yet but I am excited to put them down to see--Anna's father's name (Norway-and this would also be y grandmother Inga's father too!) was Nels Lesswig and her mtoher's name was Karen Jonasdatter. I don't know if this will help someone loook up anything in Norway--the daughters I know of are my grandmother Ingeborg, Anna, Sarah and Mary. I am not sure how many more there were and who came over to America and when. I would like to find anything at all out about this family as I haven't been able to get over to Norway with this family yet. Thanks for any information you can help with. I am going to start looking more now too. I am hoping this will be the break I needed to get going on Grandmother's side. Thanks for the help of any kind--including telling me where to look next. Debra
DebraI have been searching every type of record I know of and so far I cannot even find the last name of Lesswig? Does anyone on here even know if this could be a correct last name in Norway? I have found several Karen Jonasdatters but none with the correct husband? I tried The Digitalarkivet and I click on English and I can read that but then when I go to search it all goes back to Norwegian, what am I doing wrong? Is there a way to get it to stay in English so I can read what it is saying? Thanks for any help. Debra
BriningHi Debra How exciting for you. [:D] The names you got are probably Americanized but I have found one potential prospect in the [url="http://129.177.171.80/cgi-win/webcens.exe?slag=visbase&filnamn=f71664.wc2&variabel=0&postnr=4008&fulle=true&spraak=n"]1875 Census[/url] The farm name doesn't match but names changed if they moved to another farm. Nils Pedersen with wife Kari (Karen?) Jonasdatter. Ane the correct age for Anna Halsted and Marit (Mary?) and Sigrid (Sarah?). I don't know of any way to get the headings in English but there is a link to a Norwegian dictionary under links below. You might want to print out a page and then write in the English translation for reference. I hope this is the one but if not you are getting the information you need and it will all come together someday. Also remember when searching spellings change so it is better to search using starts with or contains. Carla
thelebrityAccording to the ship manifest Ingeborg F(i)enstad was going to her sister at West Superior, Wisconsin. It seems that many immigrants from the Trøndelag area settled there. Superior is situated in Douglas county, Wisconsin. You might find something at the Douglas pages at Rootsweb: http://resources.rootsweb.com/USA/WI/Douglas/
DebraI am getting excited about finding something anyway! I looked up that census and was quite excited as it made sense to me about the names etc. I was wondering though bout the age of GGrandmother, Kari or Karen as she would have been 47 years old when she had Grandmother! She was getting up there in age if that is her. I didn't know of any sons but there could have been some for all I know, just never heard Mom talk of any. I am checking in to more about that other Ingeborg too that went to Douglas County Wisconsin as I heard lately that Sarah lived up by Canada. Another relative remembers her coming to visit and she lived up by the Canadian border. That is all I know about her, don't know her married name or even if she went by Nelson like Grandmother and Anna did before marrying. Just so many questions! It is fun though. I still can't believe we know so little about our Grandmother and she was alive until 1965. My Aunt who took care of her the last years of her life never even knew her parents names to put on her death certificate (I had sent for hers too). I was pleasantly surprised to see Anna's on hers when I got it. Debra
DebraI have spent most of today searching for names. Why do my family seem to be hiding? I either don't know where to look or know HOW to look. I tried looking up all the names that were on the census mentioned above and found several of each of those names but none matched with the names on that census so I could see if there was more information and get something to confirm. I have been reading on researching but somehow I don't seem to find things like you all do. I get so excited when I find something to match or that seems about right with the information I have and yet I find it so seldom. One question about the census, why would you think that Nils Pedersen would be Nels Lesswig? Do you think that someone here 'Americanized' it even though he never came to America? The other names make sense as they came to America. I am still learning about the names. I really think that family could be my family but I still have some questions of course. It took me a while before I believed the family in Sweden that people found for me was mine too. Now it is making more sense the further I go. Anyway, I have been searching both Ancestry.com and LDS all day for these names and have found several of them but not the ones from this family I don't think. Any help would be appreciated, both in telling me what to do next to find out for sure if this is my family and how to prove it or what else I should be looking for and at. Thank you. I am learning but am a slow learner I guess. Debra
BriningHi Debra Don't get discouraged, we were all beginners at one time and it took a lot of trial and error to get the experiance and sometimes it is just luck to find information. As to Lesswig it would have been spelled like we hear it and the spelling in Norway could be very different. Wig would be either vig or vik. Lesswig would most likely be the farm he lived on since that was part of the Norwegian name.The Nils I found lived on the Bakkene farm so he would be called Nils Pedersen Bakkene, In the 1865 census he lived on the Sesseng farm so he was called Nils Pedersen Sesseng. Being on two different farms also shows that he moved at least once so he could have moved to another farm after 1875. Read Børge's article on "Those Norwegian Names" The link is on the main page. If you have access to the LDS you should get the parish records for Selbu and prove or disprove that this is the correct family, like finding Ingeborg's birth record. Sometimes the information comes easy sometimes not but you are getting the pieces and they will all come together. Carla
BorgeI think we can say for sure that "Lesswig" is not the correct spelling in Norway. The reason for this is that there are no farms by that name in Norway, even if you put in "vik" or "vig". - L and S can often look quite similar in old handwriting, so is there any possibility that the first part of the name should actually read "Sess" rather than "Less" - and what about the last part - could it be "eng" not "wig"? Just some thoughts from my side, maybe you could provide a scan for us to see the actual writing?
BorgeBINGO! Found her in the emigration records for Trondhjem: [url="http://129.177.171.80/cgi-win/webcens.exe?slag=visbase&filnamn=EMITROND&variabel=0&postnr=85101&fulle=true&spraak=e"]Ingeborg N. Sesseng [/url] departing from Trondheim August 21 - 1896 for Halstad Minn. She was going with the Thingvalla Line via Christiania. She traveled on the S/S [url="http://www.norwayheritage.com/p_ship.asp?sh=heklb"]Hekla[/url]. [url="http://www.ellisislandrecords.org/search/passRecord.asp?MID=16898224590260509792&FNM=I&LNM=SESSENG&PLNM=SESSENG&CGD=F&SYR=1896&EYR=1896&RF=1&SHP=Hekla&ALTS=95%7Cseesang&ALTS=94%7Csessing&pID=102890060880"]Here is the Ellis Island arrival[/url].
jwiborgLesswig could sound like Leksvik..., maybe Nils was from the Leksvik area in Sør Trøndelag county, just outside Trondheim? Jan
jwiborgThe Sesseng farm in Selbu, Sør-Trøndelag county, in different censuses: [url="http://129.177.171.80/cgi-win/webcens.exe?slag=visbase&filnamn=f01664.wc2&variabel=0&postnr=3982&fulle=true&spraak=e"]1900-census[/url] [url="http://129.177.171.80/cgi-win/webcens.exe?slag=visbase&filnamn=f71664.wc2&variabel=0&postnr=4003&fulle=true&spraak=e"]1875-census[/url] (Bakkene) [url="http://129.177.171.80/cgi-win/webcens.exe?slag=visbase&filnamn=f61664.wc2&variabel=0&postnr=4207&fulle=true&spraak=e"]1865-census[/url] Btw; I think we should give some honor to Carla, she found the farm in the 1875-census yesterday...! [:)] Jan
jwiborgHi again, if you look at the [url="http://129.177.171.80/cgi-win/webcens.exe?slag=visbase&filnamn=EMITROND&spraak=&metanr=1398"]Emigranter fra Trondheim 1867-1930[/url], you'll find several people named Sesseng from the Selbu (old:Selbo) area. One [url="http://129.177.171.80/cgi-win/webcens.exe?slag=visbase&filnamn=EMITROND&variabel=0&postnr=90023&fulle=true&spraak=e"]Nils Nilsen Sesseng[/url] emigrated to Brainerd Minn. on Mar 28.1900. Ellis Island record shows him going to "brother Jon Nilsen". Nils is listed as "Nils Sessing" Could Nils and Jon be brothers to Ingeborg and Anna? Jan
Brining
quote:
Originally posted by jwiborg Btw; I think we should give some honor to Carla, she found the farm in the 1875-census yesterday...! [:)] Jan
Thanks Jan but it is always a group effort. It's amazing how everything comes together once that one little connection is made. This sure looks like a match, I hope Debra can find Ingeborg in the parish records and connect her to Nils and Kari. Carla
jwiborgHi, yes, thats through, it's often a team effort which put the big puzzle together... [:)] And without the BINGO! from Borge, the search could have continued for a loooong time... [8D] LDS have marriage and christening records from Selbu, 1843-1859: Niels PEDERSEN, Age At Marriage: 28, Birth: <1826>, Father: Peder NIELSEN Spouse: Kari JONASDR, Age At Marriage: 23 Marriage: 17 Jul 1854, Place: Selbu, Sor-Trondelag, Norway (Source Information: Batch Number: M426443, Source Dates: 1843-1859, Film or Fiche Number: 307012, Collection Details: Selbu; Den Norske Kirke.) Peder <NIELSEN> Birth: 12 Jan 1856, Christening: 20 Mar 1856, Place: <Selbu, Sor-Trondelag, Norway> Father: Niels PEDERSEN Mother: Kari JONASDR Kari <NIELSDATTER> Birth: 16 Mar 1859, Christening: 21 Apr 1859 Place: <Selbu, Sor-Trondelag, Norway> Father: Niels PEDERSEN Mother: Kari JONASDR Jan
Borge
quote:
Originally posted by jwiborg
Hi, yes, thats through, it's often a team effort which put the big puzzle together... [:)] And without the BINGO! from Borge, the search could have continued for a loooong time... [8D]
The easy part was left to me [;)], without Carla's results from the census I would probably not have found her. When studying local history at the university in Trondheim, my supervisor was professor Kjell Haarstad, the author of the Selbu books. I remmeber reading in them, they are packed with Selbu genealogy - let's see who can find them at the library first [:p]
DebraWOW!! I got on here just a couple of minutes ago and it was like Christmas!! Thanks all of you. I have some searching to do (I always look at everything you all give me to look at first). I was looking for the wrong names yesterday hoping to find some of those from the census with no luck. You all know where to look, guess I am just too new although I do read a lot about genealogy, you all are experienced, thanks so much. I can't wait to tell my sister as she calls every day wondering what all I have found out. The Ingeborg going to Halstad really sounds right as I found out through all my searching and contacting family that poor Anna died in the Anoka County Insane Asylum in 1926. She was married to Ole Halstad the year after coming to America and he died in 1903 (which you all helped me find too) and she had five kids with Ole since coming to America plus he had 5 or 6 before that--something happened to her and she was taken out of the home and died all those years later in the asylum which just kills me and my sister feeling so sorry for her. Anyway, I bet that Ingeborg, my grandmother, came to help her with the family and that would make sense that she was going to Halstad!! It is starting to come together as I hear stories from family members (Halstad's) and you all are finding the facts! Wow, this is quite exciting. I am quite emotionally involved with this story now though as I am feeling terribly sorry for Anna coming to a strange country and then being taken away after she maybe just can't take all the kids and her husband dying! Poor thing! From her death certificate is where I got the names and they were typed on so there would be no mistaking that but being it was 'authorities' or guardians or whatever you called them back then, who knows where they got their information but I would think it was from the paperwork from Anna as she had just been here about ten years before being 'taken away'!! I am considering getting what was wrong with her investigated too (for health reason too for future generations). My sister and I think she just cracked up with stress though. We had wondered if maybe Grandmother hadn't come and helped her as the dates made sense--Grandmother got married a year or so after Anna would have gone in to the asylum. Wow, this story is really getting interesting but I sure wish I could have been there to help poor Anna, she must have been so afraid here! Now back to checking out what you have all found, thanks so much!!! Debra
jwiborgHi again, Debra, Touching story! I really think we've found the right persons this time, but only the parish records will tell for sure. I'm not sure if you know about the famous Belle Gunnes, but she was also from the little town of Selbu... [:p] Her original name was Brynhild Paulsdatter Storset, born in Selbu in 1859. She emigrated to the US in 1881. You'll find a lot of info about her on the Net, one of them is [url="http://www.lc-link.org/libraries/lcpl/belle.html"]here[/url]. Jan
jwiborgHi Debra, some more news from Selbu! [:)] I just got a call from a man living in Selbu. He have looked up the [url="http://www.selbunett.no/bygdebok/default.asp"]Selbu Bygdebok[/url] - Selbu i fortid og nåtid. ("Selbu in the past and present".) Volume VII (page 16-17) covers the Sesseng farm. The Bygdebok states that there was a girl named Ingeborg on the Sesseng farm, and that she emigrated to the US in 1896! It also list her sister Anne, but no emigration info about her. I believe he said birthyear was listed as "1877" for Ingeborg, but it must be the right person! [:)] Ingeborg parents:
  • Nils Pedersen, born 1825 - dead March 11th 1902.
  • Kari Jonasdatter, born 1831 - dead January 25th 1885.
So Ingeborg must have lost her mother when she was only 6 years old... [B)] Jan Btw; Both Nils and Kari's ancestors can be traced back several hundred years in Selbu, according to the Bygdebok... [:)]
Jo Anne SadlerI have gotten information from the online Selbu link but have also been helped by a volunteer looker-upper, Floie Vane, who has the complete set of Selbu Farm Books. http://www.rootsweb.com/~mnlacqui/lookups.htm The Sons of Norway was established in Minneapolis in 1895 and the majority of the founders were from Selbu.[:0]
DebraThanks again for all the information. I tried looking up a couple of things but everything was in Norwegian so I need to do something else or go back and forth to the dictionary? Also, when you say for me to look up the Parish records, does that mean going to the actual LDS place literally and not on the Internet? I have never done that so not sure what to do. I think we have one here in my city but I have never gone there, not sure what I need to do or whatever. I have only done lookups on the Internet, gotten information from everyone else and done tons of looking up people on Ancestry.com and LDS. I have also sent for lots of information through Historical Societies and stuff like that but I am not real familiar with what else I should be doing. You all seem to find so much information and I have no idea where! I love getting it but wish I could do more. I would NEVER have thought of all this stuff you come up with to find the name and all. I know about the farm names but how did you know wher to even start? I am thankful for all your help though, I just feel so stupid right now as I don't know where to go next. And Jan, you said the families can be traced back hundreds of years, how do I do that or does someone else have to do it for me? I guess I am showing my ignorance in genealogy right now but I am so excited to find out everything and yet feel so dumb! I know I need to find these people here in the US too and haven't had much luck with that either. Of course I was looking under Nelson which I think they went by but now I am not so sure. I would also like to know for sure if those are Grandmother's brothers and find them here too. I have been trying to find the whole family here but so far nothing other than Anna and Grandmother on the census. I wish I could find Sarah and Mary and the brothers if those are hers. There was also that other Kari I believe? Anyway, thanks so much for all the help. I wish I knew more what to do. How do I find out more about those Selbu books or book or whatever and would that help me? I did write an email to that lady on the Minnesota site to ask her if she could help me although my ancestors did not settle in that county. Guess I will go to bed now and work on this more tomorrow. It seems I work for hours looking up things and find nothing and you all can find everything for me lol. Debra
jwiborgHi Debra, I got the information about the ancestors from the man who called me. He was not related to this family, but I believe the book stated so. It could be just a sentence in the book saying "the family can be traced back several hundred years to this farm..." [:)] From the link Jo Anne wrote, you can find one [url="mailto:floie.vane@verizon.net"]Floie Vane[/url] who can do lookups in the Selbu farm books. I'm not sure if she will charge you ore not... [;)] I believe Borge was going to the library as well...? [:D] About the parish lookup, I ment the actual churchbook for Selbu for 1878 (christening) or 1892-94 (confirmation). That will give you the prove you need, allthough I think we have enough based on the farm book. The churchbook could give you the correct birthdate. [url="http://www.familysearch.org/Eng/Search/frameset_search.asp"]http://www.familysearch.org/[/url] does not contain the Selbu church for this period, so you'll have to look into the microfims at a local library or LDS center. You should try that, if you feel like working for a detective agency... [:)] If you go to the LDS center, I'm sure someone will guide you there. Just say that you're looking for Ingeborg Nilsdatter's christening/birth records. She is christened in Selbu church, Sor Trondelag county, Norway, about 1878. When you know the approx. date and churchbook, it's pretty straight forward to find the records. The books are off course written in Norwegian, but the names should be understandable... About Ingeborgs family; I guess the Selbu farm book contains all brothers and sisters of her, but I did not ask for that in the call. The reason I got this call in first place, is that I put up a lookup for Ingeborg on Digitalarkivet. He did not have access to the churchrecords (people might have microfilm copies at home), but he had the farm books. Jan
DebraJan, thanks. And thanks for helping me even realize how you get this information. I am so limited in what I know to do. Someone on another (Sweden) list was telling about going to the LDS and looking up stuff and they got really sick? Some others were telling they do too as the film is moving? Since I haven't done that yet I can't imagine as I have never looked at those type of records but I get 'sick' with motion sickness very easily lol. I did look up the LDS locally and think I know where it is. I have been wanting to try it but they aren't open that often it seems and run by volumteers I think. I think it would be very interesting if I ever get there. Even though I have read about the names etc it just seems so neat how you can find anyone in those years in Norway. I am still trying to figure out (even after your explanation) how you and Carla and Borge and the rest of you figured out this was my family. The same thing happened in Sweden when I gave them the little information I had (from the letter in black). Within a couple of days I had my family traced back to the 1700s and I was amazed! One lady even went to the town and found some people who knew my Grandfather's brother (only one who hadn't come to America). It is amazing how much you all are willing to help. I would do the same though I guess if someone wanted to know about someone here where I live. I just feel so stupid as I really have to admit I know very little what to do next. How do I try to find these people here in America--what names would they go by here--I think they are Sarah, Mary and Anna but never heard of the boys and I think they went by Nelson (Grandmother and Anna did anyway). I tried looking up the boys last night and found nothing on either LDS or Ancestry.com. I read all about that Bell Gunnes last night, wow, she was quite an interesting lady! I also looked up what I could under searches about that little town Grandmother came from. I sure wish I could find out more about her. I read in a book from where she settled here that she got some education in Norway before leaving and I would love to know what that meant--grade school or what? She was a very pretty lady (I only have ONE picture of her, her wedding day) and some relatives who met Sarah (but they were very young then and don't remember anything about her) said she was very pretty too--oh how I would love to see pictures of them and feel I 'knew' them a little. What more can I do now to find out more about this family by using the Internet. I haven't said it on here before but it may explain my hesitance to go places to look things up. I have been diabetic for 46 years and have had many complications from it including losing both legs and going blind in 2000. Although I have sight in one eye again I have problems with small print and certain lighting because of all the laser treatments and the three vitrecto ies etc I have had (am completely blind in other eye). I can get around quite well but use a scooter or wheelchair for out of the home. I am sure the LDS place would be quite accessible but I am always chicken going somewhere the first time and when that lady said she got sick ti sort of scared me as I get feeling weird quite easily. I am sorry if I sound like a baby, I am NOT but some things are harder for me now. I am willing to pay someone to help me, send for things or anything I need to do but some things I cannot do myself and maybe this will help you understand why. Thanks so much for understanding. I finally had to tell this on the other list too as they were giving me all these great ideas of what to do and I just couldn't do them, mostly because of my sight. I can read the computer very well but some things just don't work. I have the lighting set right etc here at home. Debra
jwiborgHi Debra, I'm sorry to hear about your illness. I hope it doesn't affect you too much in your search for ancestors...! [:I] About the search at the LDS center: The churchbooks for every parish are photographed down on "microfilms". The film look exactly like a filmroll, and contains picture of every page in the book. You put the desired film in the microfilm-viewer, which magnify the picture on a monitor. I don't think you would get sick of that, but it could of course be a struggle with your disability. Luckily there are some voluntarily look-ups on the Net...[:)] About the school in Selbu, I would guess she went to some kind of elementary school. One of the first things to do must be to check the Selbu bygdebook, volume VII, to see what it says about the Sesseng farm. You should get Ingeborgs brothers and sisters there, plus maybe other useful info. Use Floie Vane! The Sesseng farm is so close to the city of Trondheim, so I can't think of any other port of emigration. [url="http://129.177.171.80/cgi-win/wc/webcens.exe?slag=meny&kategori=5&emne=1&spraak=e"]Emigrants from Trondheim 1867-1930.[/url] A search tip when it comes to Digitalarkivet, is to search for parts of the name, since the spelling varies a lot! For instance, if her name was Ingeborg, you should search for firstnames containing the 4 characters: ngeb. That would cover variations like Engebor, Ingebor, Ingeborg, Ingeborg-anna etc.. I guess you get the picture... [:)] And if you want to trace the family further back, then the parish records would come in handy. The online LDS version only contains marriage and christening records from Selbu for 1843-1859. It looks to have been updated with some more records, but I don't think the necessary years 1800-1842 are covered. Looking up the birth record for Nils Pedersen born 1825 would give you his parents. Hopefully the farmname Sesseng is written in the churchbook, in case there would be several boys named Nils, with father named Peder in the book for that year... [:)] His confirmation (1839-1841) could also be useful. The same plan for his future wife, Kari. She is born (around) 1831, and her fathers name was Jonas. Jan
jwiborgJust to drop in with two interesting links:
  • [url="http://www.selbunett.no/kulturoppslag/rygg/foreword.htm"]Sons of Norway - history from Selbu[/url]
  • [url="http://home.online.no/~ergarber/slekt/new/"]Terje Garbergs genealogy links for Selbu[/url]
Terje might have some useful info, but I see that his page have not been updated for a while... Jan
BriningHi Debra, You could try calling your local LDS and explain your situation. They could tell you how accessible they are and they might know of people willing to do the research for you. I stopped by the one near me and they were very nice. I think mostly volunteers and willing to help. Jan's advice on searching is right on. Also remember that their names will probably be spelled differently in every record you find. Their ages will change and if it is the person you are looking for the census taker will completely miss spell the name. [:D] You are just a "baby" at this and you are doing great. You might want to join the Norway L mailing list at rootsweb. Lots of great people to help and a lot of fun. [url="http://members.tdn.com/dagwood/NorwayList.htm"]Click Here[/url] to go to the owner of the lists website. You can browse some of the postings if you click on the subscribe link. A mailing list is done through email so if you join you will get a bunch. Carla PS On the Digitalarkivet, when the list comes up to make a selection, you can select more than one by clicking on one name holding down the shift key, and then click on another name further down the list. Also if you hold the ctrl key down you can select different names in the list (I won't tell you how long it took me to figure that one out [:I]
jwiborgHi again, Carla gave you some good tips regarding the search @ [url="http://digitalarkivet.uib.no/cgi-win/wc/webcens.exe?slag=meny&kategori=1&emne=2&spraak=e"]Digitalarkivet[/url] ... [:)] I've used for several years, but I realize it might be hard to find stuff if your not familiar with the content. The main thing to remember is that the spelling of names varies a lot. So you will have to narrow your search based on the criterias you know. Example from the 1865 census: (Lets say we're looking for Nils Pedersen in Selbu, born ca 1825.)
  • First name starting with "Ni" gives you 28290 hits, if you select both Niels and Nils.
  • Narrow the hit with last name starting with "Ped", and you're down to 1200 possibilities.
  • With Birthyear = 1825 +- 2 years, you're down to 100 hits.
  • Selecting Sør Trøndelag county, you're down to 7 hits, and 5 of them are in Selbu parish.
  • Looking into the 5 possibilities, you'll find the one married to Kari Jonasdatter... [8D]
And to do a search for the Sesseng farm:
  • [url="http://129.177.171.80/cgi-win/wc/webcens.exe?slag=meny&kategori=1&emne=2&spraak=e"]Click here[/url] for the 1801 census.
  • Select "Sør-Trøndelag" in the left margin.
  • Select "1801 census for 1664 Sælboe."
  • Search for formname (Gard) containing Se.
There will be no hits for "Sesseng", but there is a farm called "Setseng", it must be the same! [:)] Note: People moved some in those days as well, so I'm not saying that you'll find ancestors there in 1801, but the possibility is there.. [:p] . Jan
DebraHi, Thanks for all the information and the hints. They really help. Between this site and the other Swedish list I am on, I may have enough nerve to call the LDS in our city today to see how they can help me or if they think I will be able to manage ok there. I am excited to go there as I know I will just love getting in to the records but it is just so much easier sitting at home doing it and waiting for the mail to come in every day lol. I have already emailed Floie Vane and waiting for her response. I emailed I think on Friday so I hope to hear from her maybe this week? I have been trying to work more with the Digitalarkivet but still having problems with it. I don't understand how I am supposed to know when I find what I am looking for sometimes when everything is in Norwegian? I am sure one day I will be on there and ding, ding!! The light will come on but for right now it seems really hard for me. When you all find me something and I look at it, it makes sense but when you give me somewhere to look up something like I tried looking up that Sesseng farm above and somehow I managed to get lost and not find anyone I was trying to find. I couldn't even get to the Sesseng farm? It said Sesseng farm but wouldn't give any names or whatever and I couldn't understand what it was telling me. I know I sound stupid but I am just not doing something right and it is so hard when I can't read everything so I can just figure it out. You mentioned the fact that I am new to this, very new actually! We went to North Dakota in August to see where my mom grew up and when I saw where she went to school, lived etc I got so excited to learn more. That was the first time I had EVER been interested in learning anything about people I hadn't known. Then I started thinking about Grandmother and Grandfather, who I really never knew, and how sad it must have been to leave family and country, I just had to find out more. It became more personal and it has really gotten addicting. I am sure they were just very normal, everyday working people but I want to learn more about their personal lives. I never knew it would be so confusing. I thought it would be hard because I knew so very little but never realized about all the name stuff-what an education. Anyway, thanks so much for all the help, especially helping me to realize what I have to learn to do along the way. I have gotten a long ways already because of all the people so willing to help me. I also have a list a mile long of what I still have to do, mostly looking up people here in the US after they got here and finding those families, they seem to have gotten lost along the way. I really need to find out the story about Anna too as I feel so bad about her. I have her death certificate and have some information on it that will help me even more yet I hope. I also had already tried to get on that email Norwegian List (Carla's) last week and never got a confirmation (OR any emails). Yesterday I actually wrote her an email and also tried the list again and still haven't heard anything. I would love being on there as that is the type I am on with the Swedish email list too and love hearing all the queries as I have learned so much. I am not sure if I am doing something wrong or what but ti seems funny I am not hearing anything? Debra
Brining
quote:
Originally posted by Debra
I also had already tried to get on that email Norwegian List (Carla's) last week and never got a confirmation (OR any emails). Yesterday I actually wrote her an email and also tried the list again and still haven't heard anything. I would love being on there as that is the type I am on with the Swedish email list too and love hearing all the queries as I have learned so much. I am not sure if I am doing something wrong or what but ti seems funny I am not hearing anything? Debra
Hi Debra, Is it possible that you have an anti spam program that is blocking the mail or does your ISP have blocking? If you don't hear from Norway List Carla try emailing the Tech Guy. There is a link on the main page under Norwaylist Advisors Carla PS Check out this page it might help [url="http://helpdesk.rootsweb.com/"]Click Here[/url]
DebraCarla, As far as I know I have nothing as far as blockers, I get spam! I also am on another list from RootsWeb (Sweden one). I did read that page before, thank you though, I am not sure what it is unless she is just behind but I would think the subscribe thing would just be automated and fast? I will wait and see if I hear from her today as I did send her a personal email yesterday. Also still waiting to hear from that lady about the Selbu book. Just been doing lots of reading today about Selbu and reading on another list about that area, interesting. I looked up when our LDS place is open to the public and it isn't open today or I would have called, it is snowing so I wouldn't have gone there anyway. I was going to ask about them ordering what I need and asking about help when I get there or whatever. I may do just fine by myself too. I also looked up more on Genline as that would be another answer but if I didn't do any better on there than I do with Ancestry.com it wouldn't help much. I can't find anyone hardly on there. I have found some so I guess I shouldn't complain but it seems they are hiding! I love their census abilities though with Ancestry. On the Bresseng farm census for 1900 Ingeborg is still on there? What does it say over a ways that looks like sister? Does that say that she went to live with her sister? I thought the dictionary on the bottom would help me but that is in Norwegian too. I get going on something on here and then it is time to do something else and I get sidetracked and frustrated lol. Debra
Debraoops, I meant Sesseng farm, I guess I need to proof a bit better. I have also been finding lots about the Sesseng farm. I sure hope that is our family as I am learning lots about everything concerning the area etc. Debra
jwiborgHi Debra, just for your information; above each posting, there are some small symbols. Clicking on the symbol containing a pencil, you can edit your postings... (if you want to change the "B" in the fam name instead of writing a new post...) [:)] The [url="http://129.177.171.80/cgi-win/webcens.exe?slag=visbase&filnamn=f01664&variabel=0&postnr=3982&fulle=true&spraak=e"]Sesseng[/url] farm in 1900:
  • 1) Nils Johnsen, farmer, born 1858
  • 2) Ingeborg Olsdatter, farmerwife, born 1864
  • 3) John Nilsen, son, born 1887
  • 4) Sigrid Nilsdatter, daughter, born 1890
  • 5) Gurene Nilsdatter, daughter, born 1893
  • 6) Ole Nilsen, son, born 1895
  • 7) Erik Nilsen, son, born Feb. 3rd, 1899
  • 8) Ingeborg Johnsdatter, farmers sister, not married, born 1869, illness: Aa.
  • 9) Nils Pedersen, pauper, widower, poor relief, born 1826
Aa (illness on #8), is probably short for Aandsvag, ie. mentally retarded. Number 9) Nils Pedersen looks like Ingeborg (Inga)'s father. He is a widower, and dies (according to the farm book) two years later, on March 11th 1902. But who is the rest of this family?? I can not see the link to the housefather or his wife, can you? None of the Ingeborgs listed are your Ingeborg... This could be him at the LDS: Niels <JOHNSEN> Birth: 07 Jul 1858, Christening: 05 Sep 1858 Place: Selbu, Sor-Trondelag, Norway Father: John ERIKSEN, Mother: Sigri OLSDR Could it be so that all of Ingeborgs siblings have left for the US, and left the poor old man for himself??? [B)] Btw; here is a [url="http://home.online.no/~otjoerge/files/word.htm"]Norwegian - American Dictionary[/url] Jan
DebraThanks Jan, This is what I have been batting my head about too. You all thought this was my family and yet I couldn't quite figure out the names (although Sigrid and Ane and Marit made sense with the switching of names?) but then it looked to me like that Ingeborg was there yet in 1900 and I know she had come to America by then? I was confused but I was hoping you were all right as I wanted to find my family so bad! I am learning stuff so fast but not quite fast enough lol as I want the right names and correct years and that isn't going to happen the way names were changed and Americanized and also the incorrect numbers so often put in. Anyway, thanks so much for helping--all of you--I am confused but still having fun and waiting every day for your posts to see if YOU have figured anything else out for me LOL. Someday I will be able to help someone else I hope. I just looked at this family again and I don't see how it could be mine either but wish it was. I do see, if the mother died early, like we thought before when Grandmother was six (now that may not be her?) but anyway, I know most of the family came to America, anyway Mom used to talk about Mary, Sarah, Anna and Grandmother Ingeborg came to America as I think Mom knew them or at least heard about them and seemed to know something about them and told me she couldn't remember if Grandmother had any brothers so she must not have known them personally? My sister is here from New Jersey now and I am going to pump her for answers to see if she remember Mom saying ANYTHING as she is older than I am and knew Grandmother some where I was much younger and never knew her. I am still waiting for more answers from some other family too. When I think of what I knew when I started with this and what I know now, I have come a long way (thanks so much to all of you on here!!) but I sure have a long way to go even to know for sure where Grandmother for positive came from. (And I hope Børge doesn't get upset with me for using so many pages) I thought of changing the subject again so it would start again with page 1!! I will just have to cut my posts down some. I talk this much too! Debra
thelebrityThere is a norwegian 1891 census that probably would be very interesting for you. It isn't microfilmed or digitalized or anything so you would have to get someone look up the Sesseng farm in the original census at the Riksarkivet (the national archives) in Oslo. But this census would probably capture your family just a few years before they emigrated to the USA. You might know this already, but the Digitalarkivet site is in english too. Although the census and parish register information still is in norwegian. Anyway, here's the address: http://129.177.171.80/cgi-win/WebFront.exe?slag=vis&tekst=meldingar&spraak=e
jwiborgDebra; I do really believe this is your family!! Nils Pedersen (listed as number 9 in the 1900 census for Sesseng) must indeed be Inga's father, I think there is no doubt about that. And I still think this Inga/Ingeborg is your ancestor. But it looks like Nils has been left alone. His wife is dead, and the childen (Ingborgs siblings) have left the farm. All of the children could have emigrated, or some of them might still be living in the area, but on different farms. The farm book might tell! The book might tell the relation between Nils Pedersen and the other ones living at the farm as well. This Nils Johnsen could for instance be an nephew to Nils Pedersen. Only the future will tell...! [:)] There was no home for the elderly people at that time, usualy they where living on their "surrendered property", which this Nils Pedersen indeed do, he is on the Sesseng farm. Jan
DebraMy sisters and I were talking last night about this and I had said what you said about them leaving him (an old man and he died soon after they all left). They said that could be him as my one sister thinks she remembers our mother saying that Grandmother lost her mother while she was young. Also, I do know that the ones Mom talked about were here (Sarah, Mary and Anna). I never heard about the boys? To make sure I have this straight, you think the name Lesswig now is Sesseng (soundex type thing?) and that is how Carla found the farm they were on. I just want to make sure I have the facts straight in my mind as this is really neat but so different with this name thing. That is the reason you really think this is my family? I realized I wasn't sure about everything last night when I was telling my family--I felt kind of stupid--of course they are just starting to TRY to understand the name stuff from those days too. I think I have read it all and know what I am talking about and then I'm not so sure again. I read several pages on things like that on the Digitalarkivet site last night about naming and stuff (have read it before too) but I don't see how anyone knew who anyone was as they all had the same first names and every other generation had different last names and they may have a different farm name too? Confusing. So you still think this family and all the information I have gotten so far about them is my family? I hope it is so I can go on but I am still sort of confused? I am trying here in America now to find some of them that came over, so far with no luck. I have tried under the name Sesseng plus what they went by here that I knew of (Nelson). I tried finding the boys too with no luck that I got on here about them coming over and the one coming to his brother. My sister is completely convinced that this is 'our' Inga too as she was coming to Halstad, Minnesota and we know that could have happened especially with knowing Anna may have been mentally ill and her husband maybe not being well as he died a couple of years later (Grandmother came in 1896 or 1897 and Ole Halstad died in 1903 of diabetes so he would have been maybe ill for years before that?). I just wish I could talk to them lol. I didn't know there was an 1891 census in Norway. Grandmother would even be on that one! Everyone should be from the family actually as I believe Anna was the first to leave (that I know of anyway) and she left in 1892 I think. How could I get somneone to read it for me or how do I go about that? Would I pay someone to search it for me-and where do I get the information? Grandmother was born in 1878 and left in 1897. Our family is so different than what happened there, everyone leaving poor G Grandfather, poor and old and alone! We are very sensitive and caring for family. I understand it was so different then but it sounds so sad. I hope we find that maybe that was a relative that was living there with him so he had someone. I would love to find other relatives and get them on the family tree too. I really would love to find some living relatives that are still there but I can't even find the ones here in America although I have found the whole Halstad family now and actually talk with them quite often now and may go to visit them soon. It has been a very good experience for me. Next summer my husband and I are going to take another trip to where Mom grew up and take a 'different' look at it, like taking more pictures of the area, getting more information and visiting the Historical Society etc, more of an 'exploring' trip. Hopefully we will uncover some 'clues' then too for more information. I have written the area Historical Society with very little luck. I know my grandparents were settlers there (read it in the town's book) and got some newspaper articles about Grandfather when he died (from the University in that state, they were very good to me). Debra
DebraI learned how to use the microfishe (spelling?) machine today. My niece and I went to a library in a small town to look at their local papers to get some information from a long time ago (in their papers) and I found I did not get sick doing it. I can see why people would when they are going fast through years etc as while we were looking for the year we wanted and the week etc we went fast and that was hard on the eyes but it got better. I will now call the LDS center and dare to go there now that I know I won't make a fool of myself and get sick! I need to get a list of years etc for what I need so they can send for it. I am quite excited about it. I have been quizzing my sister and she doesn't know any more about Grandmother either. I need to get those records from LDS I guess to confirm some birthdays and stuff. I hope I can find the brothers so I feel more comfortable about them too. Debra
BriningHi Debra, Just a quick note here is a list of the micro films for Selbu available at LDS [url="http://www.familysearch.org/Eng/Library/fhlcatalog/titlefilmnotesframe.asp?display=titlefilmnotes&titleno=90844&disp=Kirkeb%C3%B8ker++&first=undefined&last=undefined"]Click Here[/url] Dopte are the christening records, Innflyttede og Utflyttede are the records of people coming into and leaving the parish Konfirmerte Confirmation, Begravede death records. Carla
thelebrityAbout getting someone to look up the 1891 census: Paying someone to do it is of course an option, but first I would try the Digitalarkivet query forum. There are lot of helpful people out there too. If you present your case with Ingeborg and the Lesswig/Sesseng farm you might even get more help. The name practice in Norway might seem confusing, but it is quite logical when you get used to it. The patronym (i.e Nilsen) helped telling people who you were, and the farm name (i.e. Sesseng told people where you lived. And this system actually is great for genealogy. When you have a person's full name, you know his father's first name and where he lived at the time your source was made. Sometimes you will find that the family stayed at the same farm for generations, and sometimes they moved around (but often within the same parish), and then the farmname part of the person's name will change. But in your case it should be easy to follow him, as he's married to the same woman all his life. When you search the birth records of Selbu you can be pretty sure the father is your man as long as the mother is Kari/Karen Jonasdatter. The transforming of "Sesseng" to the birth certificate's Lesswig is probably due to local american authorities (mis)reading handwritten documents to find information for the certificate. If the handwriting was challenging enough Sesseng could easily have been read as Lesswig. Had they been asking living relatives they probably would have gotten it right, butthe document's of course wouldn't protest on being wrongly transcribed. Good luck with the microfische reading and the look up request!
BriningHi Debra, To recap how we found the information I first found the family based on your information that Inga's mother was Karen Jonasdatter father Nils Lesswig. I found Kari Jonasdatter with a husband named Nils a daughter Ane that fit with Anna Halstad and girls with names that could be Americanized to Sarah and Mary. All of that information made it a possibilty that this was your family. Borge made the connection that Lesswig could be Sesseng (based on years of experiance in transcribing written records I am sure) and then found your Ingeborg Sesseng emigrating to Halstad MN which made another connection. And I just found a list of addresses of Selbu people in the US and there is a Mrs Ane Halstad, Halstad MN listd [url="http://home.online.no/~ergarber/slekt/new/adress.html#N"]Click Here[/url] Mary and Sarah may be on it but a lot of the women are listed as Mrs using there husbands names [:(!] The boys may or maynot have emigrated. That is something hopefully you can find out from the films at the LDS. Carla
DebraThanks Carla, that explanation really helped me. I know you all know what you are doing so I trusted it is my family but I just want it to sink in this skull (the blonde hair doesn't help either!). That really helped me and seeing Ane Halstad (even spelled like on the Selbu Sesseng census) made it even more for sure too. I need to look closer at the dates and all on the Sesseng census though as some of them didn't look right for me but I realize there were lots of mistakes. I haven't taken the time to look up the birthdays I know but I didn't think Anna's and Grandmother's were right according to that and then I was wondering why Grandmother was on the 1900 one yet (she was in America then) unless that one line meant she went to her sister's? I wish I read Norwegian. Hopefully I will have time now to look more in America for them (rest of family, like boys esp), if only I had a clue as to what their names were here and who they married (Sarah and Mary). By the way, do you Norwegians like or eat Klub? (I think that is how you spell it, Mom spelled it that way I think). My sister who is here from New Jersey got Mom's recipe and she made it yesterday and it was SO good. Mom would make it and we would eat it the first meal like a potato dumpling and then the next meal we would have it fried and that is how I like it even better. Mom always made us kids eat lutefisk and lefse especially at Christmas but since she is gone we still have the lefse but not many of us like the lutefisk so a couple of them have it themselves but not for the family meal, Mom would not like it that the tradition was broken. Oh, and thanks for the help with what to ask for for the LDS. I am hoping to get that called in one of these first days so I can get there shortly to look at them (when the company leaves). Thansk so much all of you for all your help. Debra
BriningHi Debra The only family member from the 1875 census on the 1900 census is the father Nils Pedersen. The rest of the Nilsen/Nilsdatter's are the children of current "owner" of the farm Nils Johnsen who may or may not be related to Nils Pedersen. Also remember on census think of the age/birth year as approximate. It is a long explaination to go into but unless you have absolute proof don't take them as the final word. Carla
DebraI took the time this morning and went over everything as far as what I have printed out (census) and it finally clicked!! The way it looks the ones I don't know (or haven't heard about at all) are the two sons, Peter and Jonas? Also I hadn't heard of the Kari either. She must have also came to America maybe even earlier since she was older. Ah, this is so exciting. I called and told my sister you had pretty much confirmed it from that census that said Mrs Ole (Ane) Halstad in Halstad, Minnesota and she said she had goosebumps LOL. I have to get this in my head that I can't always go exactly by the dates I have (like our census says Grandmother came over in 1897 and I took that as Gospel almost as I thought she said it and that was it). I have lots to learn yet. I am also going in too many directions as I am sending out information letters to families I know plus finding out all kinds of new stuff there to explore plus got in to the Swedish part of the family plus I want to find out what happened to Anna as I feel so bad for her. My mom used to talk about her and Ole and she couldn't have even known her!! So sad. It is so exciting to see how some little facts can start putting the puzzle together, the letter edged in black that people on here helped me with to find Grandfather's side and now this which I didn't know if I would ever find Grandmother's side there was so little known about it. I hope these pages don't 'disappear' as after Christmas I hope to really get going on all of this. I work on it way too often now (according to my husband but he loves it too). I am hoping next year when we go to where Grandmother and Grandfather settled and brought up their family that I will be able to find out more. We will also visit the Halstad family that I am talking to now on the phone. Hopefully, there will be some information that comes out that they so far haven't thought was important to tell me. It seems people back then that had 'mental' problems were just forgotten and I don't like that. I'm not so sure she had mental problems but just cracked under the strain of coming to America and having five babies and then losing her husband who was the 'main person' in Halstad (he had the post office and store in his home). Plus he had five or six other kids from previous marriages! That wasn't the main part of my family that I started with but the mystery has gotten me very interested especially since I can't find out about the other Annas. Debra
DebraMy brother, two sisters and I (plus nieces and nephew) were together last night and I was showing them all the information I have on Grandmother's side so far (now that I have finally figured it all out MYSELF!!) and they told me to say a big 'thank you' to all of you for all the help so far. My niece has been working on genealogy for quite some time and couldn't get anywhere on Grandmother's side either and gave up. No one knew anything it seemed! You all told me where to get information (death certificates etc) and I finally got a little information from Anna's death certificate. NO ONE in the family knew this that I asked, not even people who had Grandmother in their house, unbelievable!! I am still trying to manage to be home (so I can call them to order films) when the LDS here is open. It has very few hours a week. It isn't open at all on Friday (today). My family is getting together again today, genealogy is the big topic now. Between this and the Sweden list, I am just so grateful for all the help. BTW I still haven't heard from that NorwayList, either from Carla personally or from the subscribe emails I sent? I also haven't heard back from the lady I emailed about the farm books, I had emailed her last week. It looks like she does quite a number of lookups for people so maybe it takes a while to return messages? Thanks again everyone-from all my family-you all provided the breakthru! Debra
thelebrityThis saturday (november 8.) Riksarkivet is extending it's openg hours for the Archive's day. Maybe you could tempt someone into looking up the 1891 census for you , if you hurry with a query at Digitalarkivet.no?
DebraYikes, I am leaving in a few minutes. I know very little about Digitalarkivet so far. I have looked around on there but get so confused that unless someone has said 'click here' and shows me what to look for, I don't know what I am doing. I really have wanted to get on that list you are talking about on there but I get 'scared' looking at it. When I can't read everything I am so afraid I will say something wrong or not do it right? Anyway, that sounds like a great idea but not sure if I will have time to see how to do it and get on there by tomorrow. Thanks so much for telling me though. If I get home in time tonight I will try to figure it out. This not understanding Norwegian is so frustrating! In the Swedish list I have to go back and forth too (to the dictionary) and am always wondering if I am putting the right words where I should or whatever. I am sure all this will get easier as I have only been at this a couple of months. Debra
DebraI am very sorry if I sound really stupid but I went to Digitalarkivet now and was going to try what you said and I don't even know where that is! I tried a search but that was all in Norwegian and on the English page I don't see it. I am sorry but I just do not understand at all. I had the same problem on the Rotter Swedish site and the people had to 1,2 3 me through it!! Once I understood what to do I got to love the site but I couldn't do that site at first either as it was all in Swedish. They had an English instruction page but it was hard. Once I got my message on in English then people who understood English wrote to me and everything was ok. I imagine that is how it will be here on this one too but for now I am completely lost! I understand the numbers and names somewhat but that is it. I realize some people have gotten in to some of the words etc in genealogy but I haven't gotten that far yet. I am learning a couple basic words but that is it. I want to learn that site so bad but so far I haven't had the time (and patience) to just sit and read until I figure it all out with the Norwegian and English issues. Debra
BriningHi Debra When you get to the main page at the Digitalarkivet click on DEBATE at the bottom of the page Then click on new topic near the top of the page and you can enter your query. Carla
DebraWooHoo I did it, I hope anyway. After your detailed directions I finally dared to put a query on there. I wasn't sure which to put it under 'general' or 'Sør-Trøndelag' so that is what I put it under? I sure hope someone reads it and has the time to look it up for me--or that I worded it correctly to have someone even know what I am talking about? I am just so excited that I dared to try it. Debra
DebraHi again, I have gotten a long way since last being on here--both in Sweden and Norway (plus here in America too!!). I have gotten help from someone in Norway concerning the Sesseng farm but we are stuck now with trying to find Sigrid and Marit who I believe were Sarah and Mary here in America according to my mother. Someone from Norway thinks that Marit could have come over on the same ship that Anna (who married Ole Halstad) in 1892 did. It looks like Marit was married to a Severin Olsen (think they went by Hommelvikstrø coming over and not sure what they went by in America yet? if this is them). They had two children, Martha and Johan. We cannot find them here in America and also need 'proof' that this is Mary's family. There is a Martha Homelvig in the Minnesota death index which could possibly be that Martha but nothing is proven at all yet concerning this and I can't find any of the other family members if they used that name here. The only thing I know about Sigrid, or Sarah, is that in talking with some family members they said she came to visit their family when they were very young (Anna's grandchildren) and she came from somewhere by the Canadian border that they thought was Kellier, Minnesota, but I can't even find it up there. I have tried searching for her with every name I can think of but if she got married here, I would have NO idea what the name would be. The only way would be if someone could follow her from Selbu, to Tronheim to America. She may have came to America in 1891? I found out some information about Kari (the daughter Kari-my grandmother's sister) but we are still trying to find out more information. She got married and had a baby in 1885 (Trondheim) and she (Kari) died in 1888 when Kristine (the child) would have been five years old. In 1900 the census shows her husband had remarried and had another child, Helene, born in 1889 but there was no Kristine living with them. Where did this poor five year old go? Kari married Andreas Andersen Fleskhus (1885) and we think he is the father of Kristine. If anyone knows anything about this family or can think of something else to look at to find out these questions or solve these mysteries, please let me know. It will be much appreciated. You all have helped so much before I guess I just sort of expect you to come up magically with the answers. Someone from the other list has helped me so much so far and he is still wroking on some things but I need some extra help so I feel I can help him some--or know where to look. Thanks, Debra
BriningHi Debra Anna and Marit did go at the same time. Here they are [url="http://129.177.171.80/cgi-win/webcens.exe?slag=visbase&filnamn=EMITROND&variabel=0&postnr=68002&fulle=true&spraak=e"]Click Here[/url] Severin using Hommelviktrø as last name all going to Halstad MN So you might find them in Norman County. I did find one referance to a Kellier MN near Red Lake. Carla
DebraThanks Carla, I printed that out and have spent most of the time I had today trying to find them here in America (with no success). I am progressing in most areas though and that has been fun. I still haven't gotten to the LDS center here as I am still not real sure how to order the films. I did call them and talk with them and they were very nice but they are not familiar with the parishes etc that I need so I need to study that a little before ordering them and I have kept quite busy with what I have been doing on here (the also have weird hours to get there). Every little thing I find is just so much fun. Debra
DebraCarla, I was just looking at the LDS page you gave me before with the film numbers etc on it. I have figured out which ones I will need--how many would you say to order to start with for the first time? Should I send for the two to cover the christenings of the parents (my GGrandparents) and their children (which would include my Grandmother and siblings) and just try that to start or do you think I should send for the others too the first time (like the confirmation, deaths etc)? They aren't open very often and for only a couple of hours at a time and I think she said I would have access to it about a month and that includes shipping time? I may have that wrong as I didn't listen as well to that as I did the other stuff (like can I even get in the place etc). Anyway, what would you do, I think the longest they are open at a time is three hours and they only have a couple viewers but she said to get there when they open. I don't think they have many people come for that here either as she didn't think there would be a problem with the viewers, she just said to make sure to get there early--AND you need the time to view them. Any other advice as far as what to order and what to do? I have never done this before other than at the library and I didn't do it there, my niece did and I watched. I also have a bunch in Sweden I need to confirm. I am quite sure about them but just want my own proof in my files. I don't know what all happened to the ones from Norway so am more interested in finding them right now so dates will be important. I now have years but no dates. That would maybe help me find them here in the states too. Debra
BriningHi Debra I think I would look at the marriage records and the Innflyttede og Utflyttede records 1st to see if Sarah was married and find the exact dates when the rest of the family left. If you are still unsure of connecting all of the family that has been found order the Christening records. You probably don't want to order a lot of films at first until you find out how fast you are going to go through them. It could be difficult since the writing isn't always that easy to decipher and the letters aren't the same as we write now. Be sure and take a list of all of the people and dates that you have with you and remember that the years could be off and that spellings change. Good luck Carla
DebraI was just reading through the pages here to make sure I have absorbed everything that has been said and I noticed where Borge had mentioned Prof Kjell and him being the author of the Selbu books. His son, Kjell (I think I am referring to the right person?) has been just so great in helping me with translating some of the Selbu books (pertaining to my family) for me and helping me to understand some of the 'ways' in Norway back then. It is unreal how all of you are so willing to help someone like me try to find their family. With me just starting in this genealogy stuff, I feel I have been so fortunate with getting help from the best--and when I reread what Borge said about Prof Kjell, it is kind of neat realizing that. I was very fortunate to get help from him I guess although he told me I was a bit late as his father could have answered all my questions about everyone in Selbu! That would have been fun! Anyway, I just had to mention that. Debra
BriningHi Debra I don't know if it has been mentioned before but be sure and read John Follesdal's article on the parish records [url="http://homepages.rootsweb.com/~norway/na20.html"]Click Here[/url] Carla
DebraOk, thanks. I am just starting to really go in to the different parts of the sites now to learn more. Now it is starting to make more sense as I have heard a little more about genealogy too. I am on a Sweden email list and love reading all the emails as I am learning so much and learning more what to ask for or look for that way--I have tried to get on some Norwegian lists including that one told to me about on this list but I have tried a couple of times and even wrote to that Carla personally and never heard back from her? I tried another Norwegian email list too and never got a response? I really am almost getting the help I need already but I learn so much from listening to others and maybe can even help with some lookups (EASY ones from Ancestry -I did take that out for a year although my family is hiding-I love their census printout abilities though when I do find something). I will read that article now and snoop around the site some more. Do I get kicked off if I go to page 6? :) I may have to come up with a new question if I need more help (I am ALWAYS waiting for someone to come up with some great new facts about my ancestors of course though). I check this site every time I get on looking for something new. Debra