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 Otilie Maria Pedersdatter 1863-?
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jkmarler
Norway Heritage Veteran

USA
7778 Posts

Posted - 04/02/2009 :  20:17:31  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Hi,

There are many half siblings in this family but today I would like to request help finding information about Otilie Maria Pedersdatter, the only full sibling of my great grandfather Ole Petter "Pete" Pederson (1869-1933).

Otilie Maria was born, baptized and confirmed in Buskerud, Norderhov, Ringerike, Norway. She was born on Burudeie on 8 June 1863, baptized
26 July 1863, (page 150, entry 73, Norderhov parish register nr 12)

and confirmed 30 Sept 1877 (Confirmation page 156, #23, Norderhov/Norderhov parish reg I 7. )

<http://www.arkivverket.no/URN:NBN:no-a1450-kb20051111040640.jpg>

Her parents were not married at the time she was born, though they did marry later, some years after my great grandfather was born. Her father's name was Peder Olsen (1823-1898)(and he was a widower at the time) and pige Karen Knudsdatter (1830-1891). Each of her parents had other children with other partners (father at least 4, mother at least 1), prior to Otilie's birth.

Family traditions concerning Otilie are slight. My grandmother remembered that her father had a sister whom she said was called "Karen". It is not known if Otilie / Karen married or if she stayed in Norway or came to America. All letters or other paper ephemera concerning Pete's family were burned in 1933 by Pete's widow.

However, there remained an old photo album, with many unlabeled, unidentified pictures including about a dozen or so taken by Norwegian photographers. In 1984, using two of the pictures, my mother contacted the Ringerikes Blad and the paper published them and we were contacted by descendants of Peder Olsen from his liaison with a woman named Berte Syversdatter. But they did not know about Pete, or Otilie or any of the other half-siblings, until we became acquainted.

There are three pictures of one who appears to be the same woman. Each of the photos are about 2''x 3'', the first is by Chr. Vaaler from Kongsberg, the second is by August Haraldson of Christiania, the third is of this woman and a man, possibly a wedding picture taken by Alb. Lokke of Torvgaden 5b of Christiania. The second picture also has a small fragment of a label applied on the back, with the words "Chicago, ure No, lot no, no. Copies, ..uctions:" on the back, so apparently had been reproduced at some point in the U.S. I'm certain the woman in the second and third pictures is the same person as not only does she look similar she is wearing identical jewelry. Any person interested in the photos may write to me and I will send jpeg of them. There are a couple of other August Haraldsson photos which appear similar stylistically taken at the same time?--which Grandma did identify as her father and her uncle Ole Pederson (another half-brother, who came to America). Pete Pederson came to America in the 1890s, married 1901, homesteaded in Mchenry County, North Dakota until his death in 1933.

The devil is always in the details. I have looked for Otilie in the 1900 Norwegian census schedules without success. Suggestions are welcome...

Hilsen,
Jackie M.

eibache
Norway Heritage Veteran

Norway
6495 Posts

Posted - 05/02/2009 :  09:16:53  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
I hope you don't mind a small correction on your great grandfathers birthyear, see#22 he was born Jan 27 1870 and baptized March 20.
Also, I don't know what you know or don't know, but your gggrandparents married July 11 1874, see #27
In 1865 they were at Kuntaas, Otilie is named Marie and Peder is said to be a bachelor.
Otilie Maries half sister is recorded as Marie Eriksdatter born in 1857, the baptism record is
#41 - she was baptized Maren Olava!
Karens baptismal record which you probably have is #140
Peder is said to be 42 years at the 1865 census, he was born Nov 10 1822 and baptized Jan 5 1823, see #10
His parents were Ole Larsen Sundbye and Mari Jonsdatter.
Mari Jonsdatter and her parents at Søndbye in 11
Ole Larsen Sønderengen and Mari Johnsdatter Wager were married April 1 1814, see top of right hand page here

Einar

Edited by - eibache on 05/02/2009 11:06:52
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jkmarler
Norway Heritage Veteran

USA
7778 Posts

Posted - 05/02/2009 :  16:36:29  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Hi eibache,

Thanks so much for looking, posting and confirming these records. No offense about correcting his birthdate. It actually goes back to a bit of a controversy when we found his baptismal record in the mid-1980s, we kept "our" records at 1869 for Grandma's sake even though it appears to be 1870. However poor Pete, he is forever buried under a headstone that reads "1866" for his birthyear. It's no matter now!

There were several additional uægte children born to Peder Olson during the times when my ancestor was "free range" so there may be more people in the family than we already know.

Peder was married to Christi Eriksdatter and they had 3 children (Gunnild, Ole #1, Ole #2). Gunnild and Ole #1 were born before Peder and Christie married and of them we know Ole #2 came to America. Supposedly, Ole #2 never married even though we have one picture of him with a ring on the third finger of the left hand which is American-style for wedding band placement. We also have 3 pictures of the same woman which were taken at the same studio as Ole's, so it seems possible he might have married despite the family tradition. According to family tradition, he worked on the railroad and he died in the Twin Cities about 1910. He came to the US in 1880 with a first cousin and first cousin's wife to Wilson, Wisconsin. By 1900 he is found in Minneapolis and in several years of Minneapolis city directories up til 1910. He doesnot appear to be any of the Ole Pedersons listed in the Minnesota death index online, nor Hennepin county death records, nor is his death reported in the Minneapolis newspaper 1910-1913. He remains an elusive mystery.

It's always amazing how quickly you work the records! Most of the original research we did on these folks took months and months in the days of microfilm. Thanks again for the help!

Jackie M.
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eibache
Norway Heritage Veteran

Norway
6495 Posts

Posted - 05/02/2009 :  16:48:40  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
My grandmother remembered that her father had a sister whom she said was called "Karen".

she was actually baptized Anne on June 11 1821, she was born Jan 14 , see #53

Einar
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jkmarler
Norway Heritage Veteran

USA
7778 Posts

Posted - 05/02/2009 :  17:03:02  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Hi,

Anne would be an aunt to my great grandfather Pete Pederson, a sister of Peder Olsen. The sister named Karen may be a scrambling of Pete's mother's name or a rendering of Maren, the half sister's name or some other version of the facts.

Peder Olsen's other sibs are: Johanne b abt 1815, John b. Apr 1816, Lars b. 8 Apr 1819, Anne, Maren b.9 Sept 1825. Maren married a man named Hans Pederson Tangbergmoeneie b. abt 1827 and Maren & Hans' child Johan b. 1860 and his wife are the first cousin traveling companions of Ole Pederson #2 in 1880.

Jackie M.
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eibache
Norway Heritage Veteran

Norway
6495 Posts

Posted - 05/02/2009 :  18:11:32  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Peders sister Johanne was born Sept 9 1815 and bapt Nov 5, see #75
His brother John was born Jan 1 1817 and bapt Febr 16, see #30
Maren was born Sept 30 1824 and bapt Jan 9 1825, see #8
Hans Pedersen and Maren in 1865, the farm is Tandbergmoen

Einar

Edited by - eibache on 05/02/2009 20:10:15
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jkmarler
Norway Heritage Veteran

USA
7778 Posts

Posted - 06/02/2009 :  04:55:33  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Hi eibache,

Mange takk!

Jackie M.
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eibache
Norway Heritage Veteran

Norway
6495 Posts

Posted - 06/02/2009 :  13:52:52  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Peder Olsens first marriage with Christi Eriksdatter was April 10 1855, see #20
Their "uægte" Ole was born Dec 22 1854, see #41
The second Ole was born Febr 10 1857, see #24
Christi Eriksdatter died Nov 10 1859, see #33
"Uægte" Gunnild was born March 28 1851, see #81
Peder also had an "uægte" son named Olaus, born March 11 1852, the mother was Berte Syversdatter, Nordbyeeie, see #52


Einar

Edited by - eibache on 06/02/2009 15:06:15
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jkmarler
Norway Heritage Veteran

USA
7778 Posts

Posted - 06/02/2009 :  22:39:56  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Hi eibache,

Again, sincerest thanks!

Jackie M.
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jkmarler
Norway Heritage Veteran

USA
7778 Posts

Posted - 27/07/2018 :  16:38:10  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Have had big breakthrough on Otillie. Here is a timeline of some new information. I'll come back and add in some links later. Most intriguing is in the 1900 US census which says that Otilie is the mother of two children and one only is living:

5 Sept 1889 Otilie Marie gets attest from Norderhov

7 Oct 1889 Marie Pedersen marries Soren Wilhelm Thorne Holmsen in Oslo

10 Oct 1889 as Marie Holmsen leaves Oslo for America

26 Oct 1889 Marie and Soren Holmsen land in New York

10 Nov 1889 a Mary Peterson, a married woman receives 10 days in workhouse for drunkenness, would also have been charged for fornication (her male companion received no charges) but because she was married, drunkenness was the only charge preferred.

5 July 1890 Marie’s half-sister Maren Olava dies in Oslo

1 Jan 1891 mother Karen Knudsdatter dies in Norway. Otillie is listed as living in US but is not named.

20 March 1891 as Mary Holmsen, complainant her husband SW Holmsen, on charge she committed adultery with Andrew Pederson, case dismissed

1891-1892 address of Soren Holmsen: 2319 13th Avenue South Minneapolis

1892-1893 address of Soren Holmsen: 639 Adams Minneapolis (2 blocks from Ole Pederson’s address)

1897 address of Loren W Holmsen painter: 907 23rd Avenue South Minneapolis

29 March 1898 father Peder Olsen dies in Norway.

15 July 1898 as Mary Holmsen, complainant Louise Henning, making a disturbance and noise in public place, no adjudication mentioned

1899 address of Swan V Holmsen painter: 722 NE Van Buren Minneapolis

1900 address of Swan V Holmsen painter: 1615 15th Ave S Minneapolis

1901 address of Swan V Holmsen painter: 729 5th Ave S Minneapolis

9 Feb 1902 as Mary Holmsen, arrested on charge of vagrancy, also mentioned as having been in workhouse before, while in jail, Soren sought to help her by interfering with the police and so was arrested also, both in jail.

Before 2 July 1902 Soren Holmsen’s maternal grandmother dies in Norway; possible inheritance to Soren.

22 Aug 1903 Mary’s half-brother Ole Pederson / Ole P. Bakken dies in Minneapolis

30 Sept 1903 husband Soren W. Holmsen falls from scaffold at work and breaks leg

30 Sept 1903 as Mary Peterson and Mary Holmsen, arrested on charge of keeping a disorderly house at 215 5th St S in Minneapolis (which is a euphemism for prostitution), 60 day workhouse sentence. Article mentions that this is her 8th workhouse sentence.

Late January 1904 Mary Holmsen released from Camden workhouse and gets access to supposed $3,000 inheritance from Ole.

17 Feb 1904 Mary Holmsen arrested for drunkenness sentenced to 60 days in workhouse, her ninth.

15 March 1904 husband Soren Holmsen petitions probate court to appoint a guardian for Mary due to her addiction to drink and inability to care for herself, another article says Soren applied for the guardianship himself.

6 April 1904 judge appoints guardian for Mary, Minneapolis Title Co.

1906 address of Soren W. Holmsen painter: 425 Washington Ave Minneapolis

1 April 1910 Mary T. Holmsen dies at Thomas Hospital in Minneapolis of pulmonary tuberculosis (deathdate recorded in her estate papers is 31 March 1910)

After 1 April 1910 Mary T. Holmsan buried at Hillside Cemetery in Minneapolis

5 April 1910 Mary T. Holmsen death notice printed in paper

30 April 1910 Probate notice for Maria Otillie Holmsen, decedent. Soren W Holmsen petitioning for letters of administration, court date set as 23 May 1910

9 July 1910 Probate notice for Maria Otillie Holmsen, decendent, final accounting asked, court date 18 July 1910

Edited by - jkmarler on 14/06/2022 15:09:11
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lynn peterson432
Medium member

USA
168 Posts

Posted - 27/07/2018 :  20:15:25  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
go tro family search family tree type in otilia marie petersdatter born 1863 norderhov buskerud there is a picture of one of her sisters married to ekrem
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jkmarler
Norway Heritage Veteran

USA
7778 Posts

Posted - 27/07/2018 :  20:49:37  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Thanks for your post but I was not able to recreate your search and result.

Otilie had two half sisters Gunhild Pedersdatter who was still alive living in Oslo as of 1928 and Maren Olava Eriksdatter who died in Oslo in 1890, none were married to Ekrem. Both were married to swedes whose last name was Nilsen.

Okay I found it. But this tree is terribly incorrect. The majority of the people in the family are from Bølsøy not from Norderhov. It appears to me that whoever (Chance Lane?) who put this together was adding every person found with a set of parents named Peder Olsen and Karen Knudsdatter, which is too easy to do and not really true. The farm that Karen was associated with growing up was Nordbyeie in Norderhov. From at least 1874 she and Peter lived on Sønderengen in Norderhov, Karen until her death in 1891 and Peter until his death in 1898.

Edited by - jkmarler on 27/07/2018 21:01:14
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lynn peterson432
Medium member

USA
168 Posts

Posted - 27/07/2018 :  21:31:54  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
did she have a sister married to peter edward wibe buried towner north dakota
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jkmarler
Norway Heritage Veteran

USA
7778 Posts

Posted - 27/07/2018 :  22:38:59  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Sorry, no. 2 half sisters as noted previously.
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AntonH
Norway Heritage Veteran

USA
9265 Posts

Posted - 27/07/2018 :  22:50:50  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
There are several family trees for Sören Wilhelm Holmsen online. However none of them include his wife. Here are the two most informative.

Geni.com

This one with photos of his father and other ancestors.

Geneanet

In 1924 he journeyed home to visit his brother Holm Holmsen.

Sören Holmsen
in the New York, Passenger Lists, 1820-1957
Name: Sören Holmsen
Arrival date: 25 Aug 1924
Birth Date: abt 1859
Birth Location: Nrw
Birth Location Other: kongsberg
Age: 65
Gender: Male
Ethnicity/ Nationality: Scandinavian
Port of Departure: Kristiania, Norway
Port of Arrival: New York, New York
Ship Name: Stavangerfjord

Edited by - AntonH on 27/07/2018 23:27:11
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jkmarler
Norway Heritage Veteran

USA
7778 Posts

Posted - 28/07/2018 :  00:33:16  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Here are the marriage entries for Otilie Maria and Søren:

SAO, Oslo byfogd avd. I, L/Lb/Lba/L0006: Notarialprotokoll, rekke I, 1888-1890, p. 227b-228a
Quick link: https://www.digitalarkivet.no/kb20110301330572

SAO, Oslo byfogd avd. I, L/Lb/Lba/L0006: Notarialprotokoll, rekke I, 1888-1890, p. 228b-229a
Quick link: https://www.digitalarkivet.no/kb20110301330573

Her birthdate incorrectly recorded as 18 June 1863, parents names are correct and birthplace as Norderhov is correct. There is no one named Otillie Marie born on 18 June 1863 in Norderhov. Interestingly, 18 June is also the birthdate given on her death certificate in US.

Here is travel information:
Otilie leaving Norway in 1889:
https://www.digitalarkivet.no/en/view/8/pe00000000024307

Soren Holms. leaving Norway in 1889 (actually his 2nd he also left in 1884):
https://www.digitalarkivet.no/en/view/8/pe00000000024306

Landing in New York in 1889 ship manifest date 26 Oct 1889 page 4 #152 & #153:
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:939V-B5SQ-F1?i=462&cc=1849782

In 1900 census:
transcription: https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:M9SN-CJ6
image:https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:S3HY-6Q2W-HS7

1905 Minnesota State census name carried as Hormlsen:
image: https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:9Q97-YSY3-Z1B?i=71&cc=1503056
transcription: https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:SP39-M26

Death record transcribed:
https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:XP82-29M

Edited by - jkmarler on 28/07/2018 05:15:49
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