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BecEsc
New on board

USA
4 Posts

Posted - 30/01/2002 :  01:11:17  Show Profile
I hope this doesn't sound terribly naive. I just got a picture of my great, great grandmother, Mary Ann Forlie, and it's not what I expected. She has dark, dark hair and eyes...Some of her kids in the picture have white hair and some of the others look dark, almost like Native Americans. She came across on the Emelie with her parents and I have several records, military and otherwise stating there were no other marriages for either she or her husband...So, the kids are theirs, only. Can someone shed some light on this for me?

xangler
New on board

Norway
2 Posts

Posted - 31/01/2002 :  22:40:46  Show Profile
Hi, I was just having a look and found your posting. Being a native Norwegian I can confirm that many of us have dark hair, dark eyes and look very different from the Blond Viking Stereotype.
When I was young my hair and beard was blue-black. Only my eyes are more of a blue/grey. I was borne and grew up in the 50ies and 60ies in the inner, central part of Norway and there were no "foregn" elements around (unlike
today)
If you look at the population of Norway 20-30 years ago you would probaably find allmost 50/50 of blondes and darks. Today the "Darks" are increasing.

Best Regards
jan Erik Frithjofsen
janfrit@c2i.net

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Borge
Veteran Moderator

Norway
1256 Posts

Posted - 31/01/2002 :  23:39:48  Show Profile
I can just confirm what Jan Erik has said. Near where I live in Norway there are many very dark people, looking almost as they are from the Mediterranean areas, and traditions say a ship of Portuguese or Spanish sailors stranded on the coast off the area some centuries back. I have never seen any evidence in the sources which can verify the traditional saying, but it makes some sense. I addition to that, there has been immigration to Norway from other parts of Europe for centuries.

Børge Solem
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askeroi
Senior member

Norway
299 Posts

Posted - 01/02/2002 :  12:14:01  Show Profile
"... like native americans" you say? We do have a nomadic "native" people in Norway, too. The english word for our "indians" are unfortunately not in my dictionary. (The norwegian word is "same"). Today most of them are just as rural as everybody else, but some are still living in the oldfashioned way with raindeer in the north of Norway, Sweden, Finland and Russia. And their colorful clothes are often seen at parties and on the national day.

Especially if she was from the northern part of Norway she could have anchesters among this people - it's not that uncommon.

In the southern/eastern parts of Norway we have been regularly vistited by "travelling people" - again such words are not in the dictionary. They could be gypsies or of finnish inheritage a o. This is not too uncommon either, though this is more kept as "family secrets" especially as there hardly were any marriages between the "races".

And of course you have "normal" non-blondes like mentioned above.

I didn't mean to confuse you. Hopefully Børge has a better dictionary than I do and can "translate"...

askeroi
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Borge
Veteran Moderator

Norway
1256 Posts

Posted - 01/02/2002 :  15:49:16  Show Profile
I think the word you are looking for is "Laplander" or "Lap" for "same", I do not know a good English word for "traveling people".

Børge Solem
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R. A. Stone
New on board

USA
2 Posts

Posted - 10/02/2002 :  23:02:20  Show Profile
I tease my Italian friends about why those good looking girls from northern Italy have blue eyes....Those vikings got around!!!
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Halvpalle
New on board

Norway
2 Posts

Posted - 26/02/2002 :  18:26:15  Show Profile
dark hair and eyes are more common in western norway, people are often shorter too. This could be the remnants of a non-germanic people that lived there before. My mother is very dark, when she was younger she almost looked like an indian. Of 4 children, I'm the only one with blue eyes.

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Andrea Anderson
New on board

Canada
4 Posts

Posted - 07/12/2002 :  18:03:41  Show Profile


Hi everyone, my dad's family has both dark and light mix.

My great Uncle Leif had jet black hair and dark eyes, some people thought he was a native or something

My great Uncle Hilmar had sandy red colored hair and they are brothers! So you can't always go by that. Because it can jump generations. My dad has dark eyes, jet black hair, tall, and wide shouldered, but I am blonde and hazel-eyed. But slanty-eyed like from the Kvaan decent. My great-great grandparents were from the Fin/Swede border. And what found out is the Fins have slanty eyes. Go figure?


yours, Andrea





Malodie Tchapko
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LouieInSeattle
New on board

USA
1 Posts

Posted - 13/05/2005 :  04:00:39  Show Profile
My grandfather was called a dark Norwegian, but nobody knows why. He was from Undheim, Norway, near Stavanger.

National Geographic and IBM have teamed up to map the DNA of people all over the world, so maybe we'll find out where our dark blood came from!

I urge you to sign up. It only costs about $100 and that also helps fund the project, plus you get personal results at the end.

Skol!

Velkommen til Bergsagel, Norway!
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Jo Anne Sadler
Norway Heritage Veteran

USA
1100 Posts

Posted - 13/05/2005 :  06:59:22  Show Profile
Well now, this is a good topic. My Mother's grandparents were from Børge's area, they were both dark haired. My Mother was kidded alot when she was young and was called a Black Norwegian, dark hair, brown eyes and olive skin.

My Father's family was from the Vang, Valdres area and no blondes in that family tree here. I personally have dark hair and brown eyes.

My observation is that the Danes and Swedes are the typically blond haired, blue eyed sterotypes of Scandinavians.

My understanding is that the Norwegians, with their long coastline on the sea, were the predominate exploratory raiders/sailors/traders and ventured out more than Danes or Swedes into the Mediterranean areas and brought back women from those areas. Not politcally correct, but.


Edited by - Jo Anne Sadler on 13/05/2005 07:00:54
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carraj
Medium member

USA
107 Posts

Posted - 13/05/2005 :  07:21:04  Show Profile
I was enjoying reading the posts on this subject and laughed out loud when I got to Jo Anne's! My father too, was teased and called a "Black Norwegian"! He could easily have passed for Italian, black hair, hazel eyes. None of us kids has dark hair or eyes. I have no pictures of my great-grandfather or great-grandmother, but neither of my father's parents were dark. My father's ancestors are also from Børge Solem's area. One day we may all find we have relatives in common!!
So BecEsc, good to know your family is not so unusual, huh!

Carra Johnson
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Jerry
Starting member

USA
16 Posts

Posted - 13/05/2005 :  23:39:20  Show Profile
This history of different ethnic groups in Norway is interesting. The history and geography books leave out a lot about the minority groups that might have been the original inhabitants of many European countries. Later, the Vikings brought back slaves, from the countries they raided.

Gerald L. Baker
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iverskat
Starting member

USA
24 Posts

Posted - 14/05/2005 :  09:09:29  Show Profile
i was just reading some of the posts, this is funny. my father had always told us he had white hair when he was young and turned black as he got older. grandma also was fair haired and then she had brown hair after awhile. me, i am blonde still.

Kathie Iverson
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Borge
Veteran Moderator

Norway
1256 Posts

Posted - 14/05/2005 :  13:38:12  Show Profile
There are many excamples of Norwegians in the Viking sagas are known to have been dark. Most people on this forum probably know about the famous Viking King Harald Hårfager (i.e., fair hair) and have heard the story about his beautiful and abundant head of hair. However, his father was Halfdan Svarte (Halfdan the Black), so called by reason of his black hair. They were said to descend from the Ynglingeætt, i.e., the old Norse Gods.

Børge Solem
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Jerry
Starting member

USA
16 Posts

Posted - 14/05/2005 :  23:41:21  Show Profile
In my own family, hair and complexions often get darker as people get older. Up to age 7 or so, my hair was almost white, and so was my complexion. Later, my skin tanned, by my late teens at least my hair was dark brown, like that of my parents.

As I mentioned yesterday, the Vikings had slaves, but I think most of them were either Irish or "Pictish" slaves. The "Picts" would be the aboriginal inhabitants of the non-Celtic, or at least non-Gaelic, Isles such as the Orkneys, the Shetlands and the Faeroes, and such mainland areas as Sutherland and.Caithness that the Celts hadn't conquered.

The Eddas I think mentioned the "swarthy" complexion of a "Thrall," who might be a Sami (Lapp) aborigine of Norway.
"Thrall" meant "slave" in Norwegian and in Anglo-Saxon, but could it have been a cognate to "troll?" (The troll-like monster Glam, in the "Grettis-saga" was I think called a "thrall.")

In Britain the "Travelers" (or "Tinkers") are distinct from the Gypsies. The latter's language is an Indian one related to Hindi, while the former's is related to Celtic (Gaelic). The Gypsies call themselves "Rom" and the Travelers "Pixies," which means "Picts."

One of my Norwegian relatives, Jakob Anderson, was Jewish. His son, Otto, married my mother's aunt Josie. His name in Norway was Jakob Brekke, but that name was probably just taken from some town where he was born.

Jerry

Gerald L. Baker
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n/a
deleted

1 Posts

Posted - 15/05/2005 :  07:36:47  Show Profile
Hello -- Can someone elaborate, please, on the "Kvaan descent?" I have not heard of this, but the whole "slanty-eyed" thing is VERY intriguing to me! I've tried googling "kvaan" but to no avail.
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