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jungfigh
Senior member
Malta
326 Posts |
 Posted - 12/05/2014 : 15:46:02
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Thank-you again Jan Peter and Jane:
Intelligent answers.
'You know it makes sense' ! |
DL. ;o) Malta. G.C. |
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jungfigh
Senior member
Malta
326 Posts |
Posted - 14/05/2014 : 12:11:12
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I have had a 'feed-back' from the Military History section researching Donald Thomson (whom I believe 'could be' Kristian's father) :
"Because of the centenary of the anniversary of The First World War we have been inundated with requests to establish military history...Your enquiry is in the system".
Watch this space..! |
DL. ;o) Malta. G.C. |
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jungfigh
Senior member
Malta
326 Posts |
Posted - 18/05/2014 : 06:29:14
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The latest news from Frank:
"Hi Finn and Derek,
Your envelope received today thanks Finn.
Have just dome my swabs and the kits will be in the post to the lab this afternoon. (yesterday)
Will let you know the results when I get them!
Cheers",
Frank
Exciting stuff...let's hope for a favourable analysis..!
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DL. ;o) Malta. G.C. |
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jkmarler
Norway Heritage Veteran
USA
7765 Posts |
Posted - 18/05/2014 : 06:49:29
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| Terrific! |
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jungfigh
Senior member
Malta
326 Posts |
Posted - 18/05/2014 : 10:34:24
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| Isn't it Jackie...is this the last hurdle..? I sincerely hope so..! |
DL. ;o) Malta. G.C. |
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jwiborg
Norway Heritage Veteran
Norway
4961 Posts |
Posted - 18/05/2014 : 11:04:15
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jungfigh
Senior member
Malta
326 Posts |
Posted - 20/05/2014 : 16:14:20
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| Very graphic Jan Peter...thank-you. |
DL. ;o) Malta. G.C. |
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jungfigh
Senior member
Malta
326 Posts |
Posted - 20/05/2014 : 16:18:54
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Received from Cousin Frank this afternoon:
Subject: homeDNAdirect UK - SAMPLES RECEIVED: HDD34929UK
Dear Mr Frank Tompson ,
Please be advised that your samples have been received and will be sent to the laboratory shortly for processing.
The due date for your results is the 27 May 2014. The DNA test result will be sent to you before 5.30pm. Kindly refrain from contacting us about your result before this time has elapsed.
Should you need any further information please do not hesitate to contact us.
Thanks and regards,
Administration Department
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DL. ;o) Malta. G.C. |
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jungfigh
Senior member
Malta
326 Posts |
Posted - 23/05/2014 : 12:46:14
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| Only a few days left for this groundbreaking result...fingers crossed..! |
DL. ;o) Malta. G.C. |
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FrankTompson
Starting member
United Kingdom
22 Posts |
Posted - 29/05/2014 : 18:17:31
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Well folks, I’m pleased to say we have some positive news on the DNA Y-STR test  .
Please see the results attached below from the lab. (For convenience I've converted it to an image file.)
Some of it is gobbledegook to me, but the two key things that seem to stand out are:
• The Y-STR profile of the ‘Alleged Cousin’ matches the Y-STR profile of the ‘Cousin’ at the 11 loci examined.
• Percent Confidence - 95%
So I think we have proved the great-grandfather link, ie Daniel Johannes Danielson Strømme, between Frank and Finn (and, by extension, to Derek) beyond reasonable doubt. Having examined the report Finn and Derek agree.
So, quite a red-letter day!
The usual thanks go to all those that helped us with the DNA test advice.
It would be appreciated if our family of friends on this forum, who have a wealth of experience, would take a look at the results and please flag up if you think our interpretation above might be in any way incorrect. (It seems unlikely but as this stage is very important we want to be as sure as we possibly can of our facts.)
One thing I don’t understand is: ‘Database Matches Found – 5 – Dependent’. I just spoke with the lab who advised me that this does not mean that there are possibly others on ‘whatever’ database that might be related to us, and therefore worth pursuing as potential relations. I didn’t understand the explanation given - but was assured that was the case!
Some had suggested using FTDNA for the test which is what I originally tried to do, but was unable to use their website which seems to have some glitches. Finding an alternative was, to be honest, a bit of a minefield. We ended up using homeDNAdirect UK, who conduct their administration and testing in the UK. Barring a couple of glitches they seemed to work pretty well, with only a few days to wait for the results once the swabs had been received by them.
Best regards to all,
Frank
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jwiborg
Norway Heritage Veteran
Norway
4961 Posts |
Posted - 29/05/2014 : 19:36:47
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That is some great news Frank!
I've never seen such test-reports before myself, so I can't comment on your actual results, other than it looks promising.
I will try to see if I can get some comments from more experienced people in this field about your test-report. |
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jwiborg
Norway Heritage Veteran
Norway
4961 Posts |
Posted - 29/05/2014 : 21:26:56
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An answer I received:
"With these STR values, it is 100% certain that the two men in the test belong to haplogroup R1a. (http://www.hprg.com/hapest5/).
In Norway; about 26% of the male population belong to this haplogroup, but in England only 4.5%.
So this may be one forefinger for paternal relatives in Norway (which you already know).
But with only 11 STR values, it is impossible to say.
Today it is common to test 65 markers, preferably 111, before one can speak of relatives or not."
So a pity that only 11 markers were tested. Back in February, I recommended that you should go for Y-DNA37 or Y-DNA67.
Not sure if they have deleted your samples or not. If not, it might be possible to order an extended test....? |
Edited by - jwiborg on 29/05/2014 22:05:29 |
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jungfigh
Senior member
Malta
326 Posts |
Posted - 30/05/2014 : 15:22:58
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Huzzah,
My glass is half empty, or, half full....I consider your comment with the greatest of respect Jan Peter...Thank-you..!
To me this is akin : " Do I cross the road or not.."?
A scientific test has been carried out with an accuracy of proof to 95/% to confirm the lineage between, Finn, cousin Frank and me with Kristian.
In an English civil court of law, (the balance of probabilities i.e above 50%) if these findings were submitted they would be accepted as fact.
Is anything in this life 100%..?
Unless I hear anything to the detriment (scientifically) from cousin Frank's post, I will accept his findings...also..I.thank him for his clear thinking on this matter...as I do to you all whom have been such massive contributors whilst this l-o-n-g search for the identity of Kristian has been ongoing..
The search is not concluded:
I still await confirmation of Grandfather's paternal link to The British Isles (Militarily) which historically may add credence to the scientific data. |
DL. ;o) Malta. G.C. |
Edited by - jungfigh on 30/05/2014 19:32:47 |
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jungfigh
Senior member
Malta
326 Posts |
Posted - 30/05/2014 : 15:26:53
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| ..It goes on..! |
DL. ;o) Malta. G.C. |
Edited by - jungfigh on 30/05/2014 15:35:46 |
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JaneC
Norway Heritage Veteran
USA
3020 Posts |
Posted - 30/05/2014 : 18:56:14
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quote:
Originally posted by NancyB
quote:
Originally posted by JaneC
One company that is often recommend is FTDNA. Other top services include AncestryDNA and 23andme. I don't know of Norwegian DNA testing services.
Consider ordering a Y-DNA testing kit asap. Purchase a kit to test for 37 or 67 markers. If you choose 37 (less expensive) the results can be upgraded later, if need be. FTDNA says this about the 37 marker test: "37-marker matches are highly likely to be related within the past 8 generations."
I haven't following this entire thread, but would like to give a shout out for FTDNA. They have the largest database of the genetic genealogy companies. I used them recently to successfully find biological family for an adoptee who has been searching 35+ years. We started with the 37-marker Y-DNA. (Don't do anything less!) Upgraded to 67 markers and also did the autosomal "Family Finder." All can be done from one test sample. The autosomal will give you a predicted relationship (usually a range) between you and your matches.
We have since also tested with 23andMe (autosomal--23andMe does NOT offer the same kind of Y-DNA test as FTDNA). I much prefer FTDNA.
Hi all. The above appears on page 38 of this thread.
First, thanks to Frank and Derek and Finn for sharing this journey with all of us. Most of us are new to DNA testing, and as I've expressed before, I appreciate the opportunity to learn along with you.
And thank you to Jan Peter for the response interpreting the lab's comments.
Now, for the tough part.
Derek, you mention that "A scientific test has been carried out with an accuracy of proof to 95/% to confirm the lineage between, Finn, cousin Frank and me with Kristian." Yes - and also the lineage between you guys and millions of Norwegians. A test of DNA at 11 markers only tells you the basic genetic group to which you all belong. You are not Chinese. You are not aborigines from Australia. The haplogroup to which you belong is prevalent in Norway. A lot of people in Norway (and in other places) belong to that same haplogroup.
So, this is like having a witness to a crime scrutinize a police lineup. Unfortunately the witness only saw the perpetrator of the crime from the back. She knows he had blonde hair and stood about 6 feet tall. Her information has 95% credibility/accuracy. Indeed he was blonde! She was correct, he was 6 feet tall! Based on that, the police can confidently eliminate some suspects and it's always useful to narrow the pool of suspects. BUT a firm identification of the culprit cannot be made. A witness who saw more details is needed. Until one is found, the crime remains unsolved.
More markers need to be examined before you can draw any conclusions. The DNA test, for 11 markers only, does not contain enough detail. Consider Derek, that you wouldn't pay child support for a child whose father is proven to be living in Malta. It's great to have people in Thailand and Brazil eliminated as potential fathers - but it does not follow therefore that Derek is the father.
You have an excellent paper source that "marks" Christian Thompson as Kristian Elias Danielsen Stromme. That's the birth date you found after painstaking, careful, and persistent research of all possible primary sources. The birth date for your Christian matched the birth date of the "candidate" Kristian. This is your surest evidence to date to identify Christian as Kristian. Bolstering it is the long string of circumstantial evidence that the seasoned researchers in the forum found quite compelling.
In other words, I would fall off my chair with surprise if Christian is NOT Kristian. That said, we have no further proof now, after this limited DNA test, than we had before.
I had expected that the lab with which you worked would have asked your goal, and explained to you the appropriate DNA test. Jan Peter's source is suggesting 37, 67, or better yet 111. As I reread my long ago comment about 37 markers, it now seems to me that 37 markers may be inadequate. But surely the lab with which you are working can and should make the correct recommendation.
If I'm misunderstanding the situation, I hope Jan Peter or others will speak up and correct me. But I don't think so.
The 11 marker DNA test needs to be upgraded, and if not, the initial goal has not been achieved and we have not achieved certainty with regards to Christian Thompson's paternity.
Don't mean to rain on your parade... I am soooo sorry to say this! |
Edited by - JaneC on 30/05/2014 19:24:20 |
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Christain Tromm
